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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 2:15 am 
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TBH I'm shocked that you guys are downplaying the 7970 when it's the best single GPU currently available market, and it's priced fairly in comparison to the GTX 580.

Give it a few months and I'm sure it will cost $300-400 and we'll see a bunch of people buying them.

I'm actually starting to agree with the sentiment at AnandTech that this place is developing an nVidia bias.

WE DON'T NEED NO MODERATION either. Pink Floyd said it well, albeit about something else. ;)

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:23 am 
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i am going to delete the OFF TOPIC nonsense in the tech threads

i'll give you a couple of minutes so you can C&P anything you think is important

If you want to call out members - PERSONAL FORUM ISSUES

UPDATE: Deleted the nonsense posts.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:29 am 
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ABT developing an Nvidia bias? Doubtful.

We have some AMD supporters posting here and i also like AMD.

ABT is a media partner with both Nvidia and AMD.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 4:39 am 
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SickBeast wrote:
nvidiacookies wrote:
Now here's my complaint. As usual, AMD is not as good as nvidia is with dual gpu support. When it works, it works well: My performance in bf3, crysis 2, was much much faster than 580 sli.

If you look at the graphs at ABT and do the math, crossfire is more efficient. It's around 5% faster IIRC.

As someone who just had a GTX 460 SLI setup, let me tell you, SLI is far from perfect. I'm not saying that Crossfire is better, just that multi GPU is a waste of time IMO.

What do you mean by "support"?

It would be interesting to know who typically releases a multi gpu profile faster (amd or nvidia).


Well, i'm well aware of the pitfalls of dual gpu, the things I don't like about NV dual gpu setups is that they are typically extreme power hogs and generate a TON of heat, while so far the 7970 xfire immediately turns off the 2nd card when not gaming. Its pretty damn nifty to be honest with you. Produces a lot less heat and less noise than GTX 580 sli setup.

On the flip side of the coin, some stuff is just confusing. Batman: AC does not scale in xfire at all, in fact it does not even utilize the 2nd GPU - I have the MSI afterburner overlay and my 2nd GPU stays at 0%. This game has been out far too long to not have xfire support yet, while NV had it on day 1. And witcher 2, i've since got that fixed by using an updated driver (the 1/9 driver on the AMD website) so it is scaling in xfire now, both GPU's at near 100%.

I'll tell you i'm mighty impressed with the 7970s despite the shortcomings, and to be honest i'll probably prefer that system for personal gaming. That my friend is how impressed I am with the 7970, it is good hardware. But its downright confusing how AMD has taken a month to get xfire profiles out for various games such as bf3 and such. And still no profile for skyrim and batman: AC. All that said - the hardware is ridiculously good, especially when overclocked. And most games DO work, i'm just pointing out some that don't. Since NV really stepped it up in terms of getting SLI drivers out fast, I think AMD should do the same. Its only fair for customers that spend 1200$ on AMD GPU's right?! They just released a CAP today, so hopefully they got the message. I understand they had shakeups recently and what not, hopefully they'll fix this.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 6:51 am 
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apoppin wrote:
HardOPC is being hard on AMD for a change ,,,, here is their editorial on the state of CF-X drivers
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/01/ ... unity_lost
Quote:
We know many of you are anxious to read a Radeon HD 7970 CrossFireX evaluation from us. We are anxious to write it! We have been as polite as we can, and given AMD every opportunity to give us the best driver to show off the Radeon HD 7970 CFX in the best light possible, but here we are one week in with no driver or CAP for public consumption.

One week is simply unacceptable to not have a proper CrossFireX driver and CAP for your new GPU. First impressions are very important, and AMD is leading with a bad first impression with Radeon HD 7970 CrossFireX. We let AMD know last year that we thought its driver ways were turning into a huge negative for AMD GPU owners. We were told in December at the Radeon HD 7970 press briefing that 2012 was going to be different in terms of software support. What AMD is doing and what AMD is saying are two different things. It brings up painful memories about last year's CrossFireX support in games and reminds us of the Radeon's past when it comes to drivers.

The Bottom Line

We have to just sit here with our heads in our hands and wonder why AMD is seemingly trying its best to piss off its customers that spend the most on its retail products; the CrossFireX gamer. We have seen more than a few AMD video card owners openly express that AMD’s lacking driver support is pushing them to not consider an AMD GPU for their next buy. And honestly, it is hard to hold that decision against them.

Remember the days of monthly Catalyst Driver releases? Remember the days of Terry Makedon, the "CatalystMaker" pushing those out? That all seemingly ended when Terry moved to CPU marketing and AMD seems to think that all of those efforts are no longer important. Let’s sit back and see if AMD squanders what could likely be it best GPU ever.

As we are getting ready to publish this, AMD's PR company has sent us a new CFX driver, but it is still full of bugs. We have been told though that RC11 is coming later this week, and "that is planned to be released publicly as well." No date was given. If you put down big cash on HD Radeon 7970 CrossFireX you are not being ignored, but you surely are not being attended to either.


Kyle has my respect.. just speaking up for the gamers and their $1100+ spending.

Nothing to do with rooting for Nvidia or AMD, as far as fanboyism goes. Only a fanboy accuses the other of being a fanboy even when he's not 100% absolutely, utterly sure about it himself.

Me, I do hold Nvidia in higher regards, for the commendable Stereo3D support which means a lot to the 3D gaming experience. Even if a Radeon card were performing twice as fast, for the same price, I'd still go for an Nvidia card just for the 3D capabilities. My last AMD card was a Radeon HD 4870, after having an HD 4850, HD 3850, and X1900XTX in my second ("wife's") rig since it had that damn 60Hz monitor. If the monitor were able to do S3D, then I wouldn't be having a Radeon card since the X800XT All-In-Wonder which was a flagship GPU with AWESOME video tuner capabilities. My "own" rig with my 24" CRT monitor that personally served Stereoscopic 3D flavor for so many years always had a Geforce card in it, and I've been using S3D since the 6800 Ultra AGP, then the PCI-E version, then 7900GT, then 7900GTX SLI, then 8800GTX and now GTX 460 1GB. Hail 3D gaming!!! Nothing to do with rooting for Red or for Green, but for an added dimension, that's all folks!

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 2:55 pm 
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What about HD3D?


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:03 pm 
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nVidia had a Press release about gaming is more than just fast frame-rates and hits my mind-set ever since GPU's could hit 60 frames. Was honored to be quoted twice in that release. The pursuit or crusade, hehe, for gaming experiences and the quality of the pixel was much more important then a number on a screen. Obviously performance is important but at what expense? Lower quality? Less immersion? What's the point of having all this raw performance if immersion and the gaming experience bars are not raised?

nVidia has changed from the long and winding road of aggressive optimizations and ever since 2008 it's been a very nice experience having their hardware in my gaming rig. From flexibility, quality, to gaming experience potential because I can only play one title at a time and enjoy having the most immersion when I play them. I don't just desire to just play a game or good enough but experience the gaming titles.

While many gamers enjoy sharing benches, for me, it was dissecting filtering or the quality of super-sampled or polygon edges. I do hold both in high regards and do respect their engineering teams very much so but am pro-nVidia at this time.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:11 pm 
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When is the last time that you had an AMD graphics card? Have you recently had a chance to put it against a Nvidia card to compare IQ?


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:28 pm 
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Sure, I investigated 2900Xt, 3850, CrossFire 4850's, 5870's and 6950's. One of my best friends has AMD platforms. When I was pro-ATI always investigated nVidia products as well. Don't trust many sites or gamers blindly with my own eyes and don't believe they're the same. I've been with nVidia ever since they improved their filtering and multi-sampling transparency feature. Have no reasons to leave them and would sacrifice too much going AMD.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:34 pm 
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It sounds like you could do IQ reviews for publication.
:)


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:59 pm 
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It has been wonderful to see how filtering has evolved and watched closely how ATI did improve their filtering or what some may say rip-mapping with the Original Radeon. I remember a discussion at Beyond 3d and was such vile and venom for this filtering but it wasn't a lod trick but angle dependent filtering -- it is known now but back then it wasn't. Did try to investigate as many angles and investigate the mip-map transitions on them. It really did improve with future drivers but did suffer mip-map banding on higher noise textures but with just a x2 super-sampled setting in conjunction did a great job of cleaning it up.

Another area that wasn't discussed too much back then was FSAA and 16-bit color --- where 3dfx didn't suffer from 16-bit color banding -- both ATI and nVidia did. However, around Feb of 2001, I watched ATI implement 16-bit FSAA dithering and it was amazing how the FSAA banding, after a few months, vanished. With ATI improving these two aspects, I knew they were serious about gamers and improving the experiences.

It's been wonderful to see the companies fight with each other, sometimes too aggressive, too disingenuous but over-all brought so much joy to millions, which creates such passion and defenders of the companies they like. I came up during the 3dfx days and where my passion was first ignited -- and remember Dave Baumann as a newbie posting away, hehe!:)


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 8:55 pm 
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apoppin wrote:
What about HD3D?


I'll reserve my comment on that until you do a review on HD3D vs 3D Vision! :P

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:18 pm 
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Please don't wait. i'd love to hear your comments. And it is going to be awhile since the ViewSonic display that i am evaluating is not a fair comparison as it only does "passive" with specially written 3D SW just for it. i am arranging for a VS 24" display to be sent that also does active HD3D and that is when my comparison article gets published.

Passive interleaved where the horizontal resolution is cut in half to each eye is entry level 3D - great for the kids and the casual gamer. Maybe for 3D movies and several guests or family members can each have a pair of cheap polarized passive glasses.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:29 am 
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SickBeast wrote:
TBH I'm shocked that you guys are downplaying the 7970 when it's the best single GPU currently available market, and it's priced fairly in comparison to the GTX 580.

Give it a few months and I'm sure it will cost $300-400 and we'll see a bunch of people buying them.

I'm actually starting to agree with the sentiment at AnandTech that this place is developing an nVidia bias.

WE DON'T NEED NO MODERATION either. Pink Floyd said it well, albeit about something else. ;)


What the heck are you even talking about?

And forget the 7970, i want to see what value the 7950 can bring us.

This is the card that will be 300-400$, and its the one i am waiting for.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:51 am 
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apoppin wrote:
Please don't wait. i'd love to hear your comments. And it is going to be awhile since the ViewSonic display that i am evaluating is not a fair comparison as it only does "passive" with specially written 3D SW just for it. i am arranging for a VS 24" display to be sent that also does active HD3D and that is when my comparison article gets published.

Passive interleaved where the horizontal resolution is cut in half to each eye is entry level 3D - great for the kids and the casual gamer. Maybe for 3D movies and several guests or family members can each have a pair of cheap polarized passive glasses.


Well, I have not yet really played much in HD3D except at the local Microcenter store with their "display" PC and 3D glasses.. and I have to say that it sucks. IZ3D actually has better support for stereoscopic 3D.. in fact, far better support for it. AMD is supposedly trying to use IZ3D and TriDEF, while making it look like as if it's AMD's own effort but I'm not still sure about that though, if things have changed already. For some games, the depth of 3D cannot be configured (user-configurable), and it hardly looks 3D at all - when the depth should be "full" rather than say, a literal centimeter into or beyond the monitor's surface.

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Which one do your intentions belong to: Heaven, or Hell?
If you DIE tonight, do you partake in good days, good days, good days, good days, good days, good life in Heaven, forever and ever?

To be forgiven by Jesus, He rose us from the sinful dead with bonding love.

______

Dear GOD, My GOD, I Will Live With YOU In YOUR BONDING LOVE and YOUR Heavenly Faith And Love Forever And Forever, Amen.


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