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Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - dmcowen674 - 05-03-2015
5-2-2015
Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover
President Obama is about to use Special Forces to put Texas under martial law.
Wal-Marts in West Texas that supposedly closed for six months for "renovation."
That's what they want you to believe.
The truth is these Wal-Marts are going to be military guerrilla-warfare staging areas and FEMA processing camps for political prisoners.
The prisoners are going to be transported by train cars that have already been equipped with shackles.
"It is important that Texans know their safety, constitutional rights, private property rights and civil liberties will not be infringed upon," Abbott said.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - SteelCrysis - 05-03-2015
Uh, what if the political prisoners will be actually imprisoned by the state of Texas itself for being...liberal? And if the special forces threat is just a lie? Assuming this isn't tin foil hat bullshit.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - dmcowen674 - 05-03-2015
(05-03-2015, 09:38 PM)SteelCrysis Wrote: Uh, what if the political prisoners will be actually imprisoned by the state of Texas itself for being...liberal? And if the special forces threat is just a lie? Assuming this isn't tin foil hat bullshit.From the article:
There's no argument that after the 2014 election, Texas politics took a further step to the right.
The 84th session of the state legislature has given ample proof of that.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-04-2015
(05-03-2015, 11:51 PM)dmcowen674 Wrote:(05-03-2015, 09:38 PM)SteelCrysis Wrote: Uh, what if the political prisoners will be actually imprisoned by the state of Texas itself for being...liberal? And if the special forces threat is just a lie? Assuming this isn't tin foil hat bullshit.From the article:
There's no argument that after the 2014 election, Texas politics took a further step to the right.
The 84th session of the state legislature has given ample proof of that.
This is good stuff if true, very funny.
Obama has used executive order far too often, and shoved ACA down a protesting America's throat, but I doubt he's invading Texas. (would be kind of nice if he did though, would probably get him out sooner than later)
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - ocre - 05-04-2015
Hog wash!!!!!!!
You guys are funny
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-05-2015
Quote:The reason they call it the American Dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it. -- George Carlin
America's system works for people willing to work. Know lots of families where they have over $100K coming in, although most these days do have both husband and wife working to some extent to get it. (obviously most people don't make $100K)
$100K isn't "Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous" by a long shot, but at that level income here you can afford a good house, car, to help your kids with college, go on vacations, and save for retirement.
That's not bad.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - ocre - 05-05-2015
The best conspiracy theories take a little bit of truth or strangeness and a lot of imagination.
Although it is a secret mission and little information is public, there has been an effort to try to push an exercise like this for some time.
http://www.truthandaction.org/operation-jade-helm-massive-military-drill-across-7-states-unconventional-warfare/
The truth is that the states know about it, the military know about it, Walmart knows about it. But it is still not being advertised because it is a matter of national security. This shroud of secrecy is fertile ground for conspiracy theories. Strangly though, Texas is the one state that seems to be crazy enough to grow the idea.
This country is getting more whacked everyday
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-05-2015
I used to have a FB friend who was always posting tin foil hat stuff like this, like "FEMA stockpiling bullets in preparation for government takeover! Coming for our guns!" and the like.
Super nice guy, but ended up unfriending him because you can only stand so much "the government is out to get us!" malarkey.
I'm sure there are all kinds of preparations the govt goes through for attacks domestic and foreign, I'm pretty glad they do. Like I told the ex FB friend, "Even if the tin foil stuff WERE true, not like we're standing off the US military with our hunting guns".
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - ocre - 05-06-2015
What are they supposed to be doing with us, you know, after the government take over?
Turn us into slaves to mine gold..........,,
Lol
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-06-2015
(05-06-2015, 06:44 AM)ocre Wrote: What are they supposed to be doing with us, you know, after the government take over?
Turn us into slaves to mine gold..........,,
Lol
We're all going to be shale oil field workers. The profits from the oil we produce will be used to give $50K a year to everyone who had less than $20K on their return last year.
Those "hard workin' folks" have paid their dues, and now it's time we give back to them. It will improve the economy because they are likely to spend the money.
Enough of this trickle down nonsense!
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - ocre - 05-08-2015
shackle down economics?
lolol
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-08-2015
(05-08-2015, 07:27 AM)ocre Wrote: shackle down economics?
lolol
Well played sir!
We won't mind being slave wildcatter oil men Ocre. Our lives behind keyboards have well prepared us for extracting oil from shale, we're natural frackers!
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - ocre - 05-08-2015
Rough-neck simulater 2015
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-08-2015
(05-08-2015, 02:24 PM)ocre Wrote: Rough-neck simulater 2015
Only when we have transferred over half of the country's wealth to the poor will the economy be saved.
They have the wisdom necessary to steer the ship to a safe harbor.
I am investing in Pabst Brewing, Little Debbie Snack Bakery, and WWF in anticipation of this golden era. Obama is reviving the "Camelot" name for the prosperous kingdom of roughneck slaves and the new lords and ladies.
Although my wife's skill at preparing balance sheets and financial statements is no longer needed, she has been told one of the new noble families in town (Skeeter and Loretta McGurk) have an opening for a charwoman.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - ocre - 05-08-2015
Are you dirt poor gstanford?
I came from a dirt poor family. I was raised in a family that would get food from churches. When my dad didn't have a job, we had loads of food from the food stamps. Literally, the fridge and cabinets completely bulging with food. But, when my dad worked low minimum wage jobs, the working poor, we had nothing. We lived in a shit hole dump. We were lucky if we made it 3 months straight without a utility being temporarily disconnected for weeks at a time.
We were so poor I went through all of high school without eye glasses. My vision so bad, I couldn't see the chalk board. The clothes I wore, they were hand me downs 2 generations.
This is the short and sweat version. I don't want pity or attention. the truth is, i am barely scratching the surface. I grew up on the absolute bottom and live it. Unless you been there, you can't ever really know.
Now I will get to why am I telling you this. When I was young, I thought my father really tried. Cause he did. But as a grew up, now that I am grown, I know the reason we struggled for all those important years, it was simply because my father wasnt putting enough effort in getting us out of the poverty we were in. When he got the absolute lowest paying jobs there were, he didn't strive to find better. He did not at all. He settled for poverty and we all lived it. I would never call it smart, I mean that is the last thing I would call it.
My father didn't strive to give us a better life. That is all there is to it.
You don't have success by accident. You have to earn it. And I know. God do I know.
I wasnt born with a silver spoon. And I have built a decent living just to have it all stripped away. I fell hard from my branch, stripped of everything. down to a shit hole trailer with the floors falling in. I am talking about a dump that gangstas in the ghetto wouldn't live in. I had nowhere else to go. Struggling for any income I could manage. But I had a wife, and she had a child. One that I would never want to grow up in that stupid dump.
I didn't settle. I found work. But most importantly, I didn't stop there. I didn't accept those peanuts, just fed on them till I was able to start putting my life back in motion.
I was driven to do better. I needed to do better. And so I did.
I worked my way well past the branch I once was proud of. It was dedication, I had to make a better life for my family, for my kids.
Anyone can be hit with hard times. And most people start out on the bottom. But, I am telling you man. If you really want better, it is up to you to make it happen. Anyone can make their life's better. But you have to really work at it. See my dad, i remember he play the lottery as much as he could. can you believe it, lottery tickets over and over.
When I grew up and moved out, he finally got a job making a whopping 2 times the minimum wage. You know what he did? Casinos. He spend all his money, trying to hit it big. And the saddest part, when he did when 10 and 20 thousand, he would stay up there until he blew every dime and then some.
Eventually he pawned things and piled up mountains of debt.
But that was his plan to hit the big time. That was his plan. Oh how great it would be, if he just hit the jackpot!!
It would be so funny, if it wasnt so freaking sad to me.
That is a great dream but that's not the answer.
You want a better life, you make it happen. And it isn't easy. It takes work and most importantly........intelligence.
You are gonna sit here and tell me that people on food stamps are the smart ones? Well, I grew up around them. I grew up on them. And I can tell you first hand, smart isn't a trait needed to be dirt poor.
If you want to get out of poverty, now that takes a lot of work and smarts. It is not the other way around.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - SteelCrysis - 05-08-2015
Jade Helm fearmongering debunked: http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2015/05/operation_jade_helm_chill.html
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-08-2015
Ocre- you speak the plain truth nobody wants to hear.
They all want to hear "The man should pay us $15 an hour to flip the burger and $30 an hour to do anything else." or worse yet "The rich should just GIVE the poor a bunch of money because they can afford it. Lets make laws to get this started!".
The poor are a bucket you can never fill. My family and I go to plays from hundreds of years ago and they talk about the exact same problems with the poor.
I went from upper middle class to poor to upper middle class again and as you say, it's all in working at getting ahead and trying things until you do. Most of the people I know who would be considered "well off" (and myself) sought out training, switched jobs, learned skills, and partnered with other survivors who did the same.
Your story is a bleak and stark reminder of the alternative. I'm going to make my teenage son read it tonight, it should be required reading for EVERY child.
Thank you for posting this. So sick of half the nation looking at successful people as a rainy day cookie jar they want to take off the refrigerator and plunder "for the good of the economy".
When I couldn't make ends meet on one job, I worked two. When I had no health insurance, I looked for jobs that did.
Worked my way through college twice and then learned a totally unrelated IT trade when that didn't work. No one owes me, or anyone, a free lunch.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - ocre - 05-09-2015
Gstanford, its not about falling on hard times. Its not about being on food stamps. We live in a society that has a safety net. see, in the absolute worst case, you damn sure won't starve unless it is your choice. The issue isn't people that need help. Very few people out there have an issue helping those in need. The truth is, we are a nation so rich that our poor and unemployed don't suffer as they would in other countries. As a matter of fact, our poverty here in the US today is living better than most humans throughout the history of mankind.
Dirt poor as I was, I never starved. We had shelter and my chance of living were really really high. It is not a matter of life or death, in the US......it is a matter of how you want to live.
If you want to be a bottom feeder, you can live your life on the bottom. Its there for you.
If you want better, you can make it happen. All you have to do is put your time and energy, your mind and efforts towards it. That is true, no matter who you are. You can better your life.
The problem is that it takes a lot of work. It is a long journey and the trajectory most likely won't be straight up. There will be slips and falls, many mistakes. Much of the progress isn't even measured on a dollar scale. You have to better yourself as you better your life.
We were all born babies. We learned to cry when we want something. And it worked, works very well. The truth is, so many people never grow up. They either don't know how, aren't ready yet, or just don't want to grow up. This idea that everything you want should appear before you just because you opened your mouth, this is the way a baby thinks.
Growing up poor, as a middle child, I watched. I put together things I was never taught. But I still had no idea what I was doing, I just new.........I wasnt gonna do that.
Its not about falling hard or needed help. Its all in how you pick yourself up. Loosing everything you built is a huge punch in the guts, not everyone can fully recover from that. But what are you gonna do? Sit there and cry about it?
There is nothing wrong with crying, let it out. Let it all out. But at some point, you have to realize that you are not a baby. And crying will not get you out of the mess. Crying is not the answer, not when you have truly grown up.
I am not against subsidies. I just knew that I didn't want anyone paying for my children. I was gonna provide for them. I would make sure of that, as long as I am alive and capable. I could still be living in a trailer and barely getting by but I set out to give us better. And I worked very very hard to make that happen. And for the second time, I went from the bottom up. But this time...., I doubled my mediocre success.
I am not rich. I actually live in a state ranked 40th per capita. It is ranked 45th per median income. It is one of the poorest states to live in. Coming from the poorest of the poor, in the 45th poorest state, would you say that the deck was stacked against me? To say the least.
But here I am, certainly not rich. I hate ever talking about my finances, it is not my thing. But my income alone is 2x our states median. In such a poor state, it is more than enough. But, you know we are driven to make a better life for our kids. So, of course my wife isnt staying at home sitting on her thumbs. Collage won't be cheap, you know.
So we push to do better and better. And now, my wife has found out she can be really successful as well. I am actually surprised by how well. Not because I didn't believe in her........
We both worked hard to have more. And are more secure than we ever have been. But, its not just money that we have been building up. Its our ability and our minds. We will find a way and when things don't work, find a better way.
So anyone can be poor. That doesn't take much skill at all. Anyone can fall in hard times but the question is, are you gonna lay right where you fall? Like a tree or a branch? Just lay where you fall?
You decide.
That sure isn't what I want to be, A tree or rock. A leaf blowing in the wind. Sure, we all let the wind take us places. But at some point, you need to take control of your direction. We are all given that ability. ......
Note:
Sorry if I didn't make sense, I am extremely sleepy and about to pass out, I didn't get much rest this morning at all. Good night!!!!
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-09-2015
(05-08-2015, 11:18 PM)gstanford Wrote: I'm not rich, i'm not dirt poor either. I live in an area where unemployment is at least 40% and getting worse (we have just had Caterpillar close a mining equipment factory here among many other big job losses). Very similar to America's "rust belt". We have virtually nothing left of the manufacturing base we had in the region when I was a young boy.
Not everyone on food stamps is a no-hoper like your dad was, most people have no say in the matter - they lose their jobs through no fault of their own and there is no work to replace what was lost.
Really?
1. They might have to leave the area unemployment is 40%
2. They might have to train for something there is demand for
3. They might have to work multiple low wage, low benefit jobs until they can find better
4. They may have to partner with someone to form a more secure economic unit (roommate, spouse)
Contrary to popular belief, no one is "owed" the lifestyle people see on tv. (everyone has lots of free time, a beautiful home, nice cars, travels)
That lifestyle is earned by sacrifice and hard work, and choosing a job that pays for that lifestyle. I don't even know anyone who is unemployed and looking for work.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - dmcowen674 - 05-09-2015
I've moved 17 times and lived in 9 states chasing a decent job.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-09-2015
(05-09-2015, 07:13 PM)dmcowen674 Wrote: I've moved 17 times and lived in 9 states chasing a decent job.
You are living what I'm talking about.
When you want to get ahead, or even just stay even, you do what needs to be done.
(05-09-2015, 11:33 AM)gstanford Wrote: In any case, money does nobody any good locked away in rich peoples bank accounts.
Paying low-income earners more allows them to go out and spend more, which in turn stimulates the economy, which is good for rich people.
Here's the problem with this Gstanford:
http://www.investopedia.com/articles/05/012005.asp
What guys like you ("just pay people more money and they'll spend it and all will be great!") always forget is the causes of inflation.
Higher wages contribute to both cost push and demand pull inflation.
Cost of goods sold rises with higher wages. Only way that does not raise prices is if owners and stock holders agree to less profit. So how does this help the economy for them? "Yay workers get more money and we get less"?
Demand pull inflation occurs when workers earn more and spend it, so as they do, owners and stock holders raise prices due to increased demand from higher supply of money. Put simply, if you pay everyone $100K it isn't going to be worth what $100K is when most people don't make it. Not to mention if you start paying the mail room guys $35K what about the lower office folk with more skills that already make $35K? Shouldn't they make $50K now to maintain value based pay? OK so we pay them $50K, what about the people already making $50, they need more now too.
Point being, you can pay people more, but supply/demand pricing and inflation will make their higher wages buy the same as what they used to.
The preferable situation is to have the situation we have where everyone has shot at "the good life", because the only alternative is "great, we're all kind of limping along" and no one has much incentive to try because the odds of making it are even lower and when you do, you just get to pay for more burger flippers.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-09-2015
(05-09-2015, 09:03 PM)gstanford Wrote: Supply/demand inflation was true until China happened and screwed up the cunning bosses plans, deliciously ironic too since the big bosses originally went to China to force workers wages down and screw unions over.
China is part of supply/demand in a global economy.
The USA is one of very few places that "could" be self sufficient, tell China and the rest of the world to "get lost".
We're producing 70% of our own oil now, can produce all our food, and pretty much everything we need either has been or is built here now.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-10-2015
(05-09-2015, 10:27 PM)gstanford Wrote: China means that businesses jacking prices up doesn't work any more when consumers can get 20 different versions of the same thing cheaper.
Just about anything a consumer could want can be made cheaper than the USA can make it and sold cheaper than the US business wants to sell it. Makes it a bit difficult for the inflation lever to work.
Couple things about that:
1. China/others sell here at our request. It's not a "China has us by the short and curlies, we can't compete with their cheap labor" scenario. We can make their products more expensive with import tariffs, or refuse them altogether. Like I said, we "can" be self sufficient.
2. So if everyone else is selling cheaper than the US already, where are businesses supposed to get the money to pay higher wages/ Owner's bank account?
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-10-2015
(05-10-2015, 07:21 AM)gstanford Wrote: Good luck with number 1.
As for number 2, the idea is to price your goods cheaper and sell more of them. Ask the chinese if the concept confuses you.
I think you're the one confused here GR. Do you think the Chinese are paying their people higher wages to sell goods at cheaper prices?
LOL
http://www.forbes.com/sites/moneybuilder/2010/06/24/one-big-difference-between-chinese-and-american-households-debt/
Quote: The average annual household income in China, converted to dollars, was $10,220, compared with $84,300 in the United States (the median US income is $47,300.)
So let me see if I understand your position Greg:
American corps don't pay enough, because the median US income is $47K.
American businesses should be successful like Chinese businesses where the average household income is $10K.
Errrr........
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-10-2015
(05-10-2015, 01:00 PM)gstanford Wrote: I never said one word about chinese median incomes. You wanted to know how American businesses could improve profitability, I answered with a tried and true model - "stack 'em high, sell 'em cheap". The extra profit comes from the increased sales volume.
Ah.
So who do you think is making more money Greg? NVIDIA selling one TitanX for $1000? Or AMD selling ten 290Xs for $250?
How about one of my son's $100 Abercrombie hoodies, or ten $10 Hanes hoodies from WalMart?
Chevy selling one $80K Corvette Z06, or Hyundai selling ten $15K Accents?
You also answered with an example that disproved your own argument of how American businesses should pay people more money, because the very reason the Chinese are able to sell cheap is they pay slave wages.
Last, your flawed analogy doesn't take demand into account. A guy who owns a Subway sub shop in a town where there are 500 potential lunch time buyers can't say "I'm selling subs with a $2.00 profit to 200 people. I'll cut my profit margin to $.50 a sub and "sell'em cheap" because that is a "tried and true" business model." He can sell all 500 diners subs at $.50 profit each and make $250 a day, or he can sell to 200 of his potential market at $2.00 per and make $400 a day.
What if he only cuts his profits $1.00/sub, and gets 400 of the 500 to buy one? Well, he makes the same $400.. (and both of the higher sales models would require additional staff and possibly equipment)
Don't feel bad, most people don't get business.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-10-2015
(05-10-2015, 07:28 PM)gstanford Wrote: LOL! the stack 'em high, sell 'em cheap model has made the Waltons (owners of walmart) one of the richest families in America and has provided China with the financial resources to modernise their nation.
Plenty of profit to be had!
LOL!
WalMart was one of the business models we looked at while I was picking up my BS-Business!
"Stack'em high!" is NOT what WalMart used to succeed.
What WalMart used to succeed is forcing suppliers to carry their cost of inventory, utilizing many part time employees without benefits, and paying low wages. (WalMart was the first (or one of) big retailer to demand vendors not only sell to them at lower margins, but carry their cost of inventory by supplying as WalMart sold it, rather than in advance of sales) WalMart also uses "loss leaders" to draw people in to the store knowing they would buy more normally priced items when there.
Also, WalMart is not a producer of goods, they're a seller of finished goods. How does that business model work for a restaurant that takes raw materials and transforms them into a finished product with a shelf life?
Or how about a business like GM where the inventory costs a lot to produce? Even if you "sell'em cheap" not everyone has $20K> to be spending on cars.
Like I said, you're like most people, bits and pieces of knowledge of how business works. I'm the same, I just have more bits and pieces because I grew up in a home where my father ran and owned businesses, I picked up a business degree, have worked in most aspects of business, and a lot of the people I've known along the way run or own businesses.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-11-2015
(05-10-2015, 09:12 PM)gstanford Wrote: If you are pricing the car at $20K then you obviously aren't selling it cheap. Take a look at Kia, Hyundai and other value brands.
LOL- know what the number 1-3 selling vehicle is in the USA Greg? Full size pickup trucks that you can't buy under $30K:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2015/01/06/pickups-best-selling-vehicles-2014/21334373/
Apparently "stack'em high sell'em cheap" doesn't apply in the US, we want a usable vehicle more than to drive a cracker box cheap-o car.
(05-10-2015, 09:12 PM)gstanford Wrote: With Walmart plenty of people purchase the loss leaders and skip the "normal priced" stuff. Lots of other bargain or 2 dollar shops sell a wide variety of goods cheaply and manage to be extremely profitable.
https://nrf.com/resources/top-retailers-list//top-100-retailers-2012
And Dollar General is at 28th on the top retailers list, with Family Dollar is waaaayyy down the list at 44. Nobody really "wants" to shop at those places.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 05:59 PM)gstanford Wrote: You mean you are a nation of gas guzzling idiots? There is nothing lacking in cheap Kia/hyundai/Great Wall vehicles, they have everything you need plus more to get you from A to B in comfort and at highway speed while still being economical in town. Same thing for cars like the Yaris from Toyota.
Greg did you happen to notice the top 5 selling cars on the list sell for $25K-$40K, and that combined they sold about as many as the next 15?
You think Americans are all hopping in their $30K cars and heading down to the Dollar General to buy some generic butt wipe?
Does that sound like to you?
The other stores you mention (E.G. Sears, Costco, Home Depot) aren't big on the "stack'em/cheap'em" model you're trying so frantically to say we need here. They all sell nice stuff, and are about as far from the Dollar General as we are from Australia.
Like Ocre said, in general the system works and even the poor here live pretty good. With average wages for a HS grad at around $30K, you get a husband and wife both making that and you're looking at $50K a year after taxes.
You can live on that pretty easily. Can't have 3 kids and drive a $30K car, but could have one kid and a couple used cars.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-12-2015
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2015/01/06/pickups-best-selling-vehicles-2014/21334373/
Scroll down in the article for the list. Notice the GMC Sierra (what I drive) down there at 211K sold in 2014? Those are fancier Silverados.
Add them to the Silverado total and you've got GM and Ford full size trucks selling more than double what ANY econobox sells. (triple most of them)
The system here works for most people.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-12-2015
(05-12-2015, 04:19 AM)RolloTheGreat Wrote: http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2015/01/06/pickups-best-selling-vehicles-2014/21334373/
Scroll down in the article for the list. Notice the GMC Sierra (what I drive) down there at 211K sold in 2014? Those are fancier Silverados.
Add them to the Silverado total and you've got GM and Ford full size trucks selling more than double what ANY econobox sells. (triple most of them)
The system here works for most people.
Read what I said GR. GM and Ford's full size truck sold over 700,000 units, no car that sells for under $20K sold over 350,000 units. So we have two trucks that have MSRP starting at $26K selling 3X as many units as the crackerbox cars selling 200,000 units.
You won't see any $26K trucks on the road either, my 2015 Sierra sticker was over $44K and it's not even the high trim line, just middle trim with some normal options.
Your attempt to spin makes my point even better though: You compared the sales of the top 3 selling $30K+ vehicles (GM/Ford/RAM full size trucks) to 16 other vehicles and found the sales numbers pretty close.
That alone pretty much proves my point Greg- you compared THREE high priced trucks to SIXTEEN lower priced vehicles and the higher priced vehicles were close even though they cost more and were less than 1/5 the number of models.
Not to mention your numbers included cars that sell for over $20K. (E.G. the two highest sellers (Accord, Camry) start at $22K MSRP)
"Stack'em high and sell'em cheap" may have applied to English grocery stores in the 1960s, but in the US auto market, we demand the opposite of cheap because we want to drive decent vehicles.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-13-2015
(05-12-2015, 05:39 PM)gstanford Wrote: Yes, I know what *YOU* said but the data in the article contradicted what both you and the article said. When you do the math small cars and trucks are very nearly equal in sales.
Yes, I know some of the cars are over 20K, but its your article, not mine. Find an article that talks about budget car sales.
No actually the data in the article I linked to totally proved my point, you just don't know what real cars cost.
15 of the top 20 cars sold in America have an MSRP above $20,000.00.
EIGHT of the top 10 cars sold in America have a MSRP above $20,000.00.
AND the three top selling cars generally cost $35-$45K.
It's pretty obvious "stack'em high and sell'em cheap" is the exact opposite of what automakers do in the USA. Americans demand quality and comfort, we don't want cheap crap.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-13-2015
(05-13-2015, 12:38 PM)gstanford Wrote: Like I said, get a list of top selling budget cars and we will see.
I doubt Toyota (Yaris, Corolla), Nissan (Versa, Sentra), KIA (Rio, Forte), Hyundai (Accent, Elantra), Mazda (Mazda3), Mitsubishi (Mirage, Lancer, Outlander sport), Chevrolet (Spark, Sonic, Cruze), Ford (Fiesta, Focus), Volkswagen ( Golf), Honda (Fit), Dodge (Dart), Fiat (Fiat 500), Subaru (Impreza) and more bother offering budget cars for sale in America if nobody bothers to buy them (yeah, riiiiiiiight!).
What will we see Greg? That there are cheap cars for sale here? Never said there weren't.
What I DID say is that the "stack'em high sell'em cheap" strategy has little to do with marketing cars in the USA, because the most popular cars in the USA are not cheap cars.
You set the bar at $20K, I showed you 75% of the twenty highest selling models in the USA in 2014 have an MSRP over $20K.
Mitsubishi?! LOL- in 2014 they sold a whole 77K cars here, including their models that cost above $20K:
http://media.mitsubishicars.com/channels/Sales/releases/0fb023a2-b57c-46bc-a356-ee32a1e9815e
That's a hair over 10% of what a Ford F150 or GM full size truck sold, and you've been crowing about PS4s at most 60% market share in the US as "total dominance".
I think you should edit your own name to be "Trollo", the only one "lying" or "twisting facts" here is you.
Yaris?!! LOL again- wowee- they sell about 12,000 of those cracker boxes a YEAR while Ford and GM sell 60,000 $35K+ trucks a MONTH.
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01/toyota-yaris-sales-figures.html
You just don't understand people here Greg. The people who do buy the cars like Mirage or Yaris wish they could afford bigger, better cars. No one actually chooses that stuff out of preference.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-13-2015
(05-13-2015, 05:06 PM)gstanford Wrote: As far as trucks go, Toyota will sell you one for just under $21,000. A $23,000 saving on yours.
http://www.toyota.com/tacoma/
Nissan will sell you a truck for just under $18,000
http://www.nissanusa.com/trucks/frontier?next=header.vehicles.postcard.vlp.image
Chevrolet have one under $21,000
http://www.chevrolet.com/colorado-small-truck.html
All these cheap vehicles that apparently nobody would ever purchase for sale in the USA..... according to you......
Why don't you do the build on those trucks and see what you get for $20K Greg?
My truck has four real doors, a 350hp engine, a touch screen infotainment system, 20" wheels, bedliner, tonneau, remote start, power windows/locks, AWD, a fake leather/brushed aluminum dash, power seat, descent control, stabiltrak, dual zone climate control, tow pack, Z71 off road pack, and probably more I'm forgetting.
As my son says, "It's like a luxury car".
For $20K Toyota will build you a 4 cylinder, tiny truck with fold up back seats and an interierior that looks like it is out of the 1940s.
And again, never said "no one" buys them. I said what is marketed successfully here is cars above $20K.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-13-2015
(05-13-2015, 05:38 PM)gstanford Wrote: Marketed successfully to high income idiots with too much disposable income and no brains perhaps....
Greg, in 2013 and back the base engine Silverado was selling 5%:
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2014-chevrolet-silverado-v-6-instrumented-test-review
Quote:Chevrolet says it accounted for only 5 percent of sales, and most of those went into fleets
Now that they upgraded the V6 to a more reasonable 285hp/305ft lbs torque it's selling 20%, but that still means 80% of Americans are buying more well optioned trucks.
You're just way out of touch with how people in America buy cars.
You're just wrong.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-14-2015
(05-13-2015, 11:54 PM)gstanford Wrote: Rollo, are you sure that happened in 2013 and not 1940?!
Very sure. I bought one of those 2014 4.3l V6 Silverados because they had just raised the hp from 195 to 285, and the torque from 265 to 305. ( and on E85 it was 297/330)
The 2010 5.3l I had before that was 315hp/335 torque, so I figured it wouldn't be much different. Even my 2014 V6 Silverado had an MSRP over $40K though, because it was LT2/Z71/All Star Edition/with running boards, bedliner, and tonneau cover.
Would still have it if the dealer had not offered me a steal of a deal on a 2015 with a 5.3l a year later.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - ocre - 05-14-2015
Gstanford,
I do not understand what you are even arguing. you are just not making sense.
Really, going back thru the pages, i am like..........huh?????
You said everyone in the USA are idiots cause the cars over 20 are more popular. Let me quote that
Quote: high income idiots with too much disposable income and no brains perhaps....
So everyone who dont do as you do are idiots?
I have a completely different approach but you will never see me calling anyone else an idiot because they dont do as i do.
See, there is a huge used car market in the US as well. I havent bought a new car since the late 90s. This is because I dont get loans for vehicles, I buy mine with straight cash. 3-4 year old cars have depreciated significantly over a brand new model and a big stack of cash is hard for any dealer to let walk out of his lot.
I do many things different than others. I have learned life is sweater without debt. No matter what happens to me, my things are all paid for. I even started saving up to buy a house, all in cash. I am getting impatient though so I think i might actually get a loan for that in the end but you know what, i will have a massive down payment.
I can sit here and say that everyone who doesnt do as i do is an idiot......but seriously how can you think like that. Everyone is entitled to their own life and their own decisions. My way comes from the lessons i learned loosing it all. It is a force that drives me on my journey. They are my lessons and how i live my life as a result. Not everyone looses it all but those that do will be changed. For me, that change was a drive to do things even better the second time. Build an even stronger castle.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-14-2015
Interest rates are too low to concern me much, but our general strategy is we stayed in our middle class house. Either of us can afford house/cabin/cars, so its a good safety net.
Not a bad feeling if something goes haywire on the job front the worst that can happen is you go back to being middle class. I never minded being middle class.
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-14-2015
(05-14-2015, 09:21 AM)gstanford Wrote: I agree about not going into debt. It is the biggest mistake people make, especially when they are deluding themselves that they are somehow climbing the social ladder and keeping up with the Jones's by doing so. When I bought my Yaris I bought it straight off of the showroom floor in cold hard cash. I'm totally debt free, don't owe anyone so much as 1 red razoo.
LOL The 2% I'm paying on my Sierra is a KILLER! I'd pay high interest not to drive a Yaris though. As far as "deluding myself" goes, I pay my bills, odds are good I'll be a millionaire when I retire, and I'm not hurting anyone, so who are you to say what is sensible for me to drive?
(05-14-2015, 09:21 AM)gstanford Wrote: If a low income person/family needs a vehicle they can buy used like you did (I did that early on in life too)I have the feeling Ocre is the opposite of low income. I bet he buys pretty nice cars, just buys them used to let someone else take the big depreciation.
(05-14-2015, 09:21 AM)gstanford Wrote: and take on somebody else's mechanical trouble, they can save a little more and get a new budget car, or they could fry their brain and let the likes of Rollo "successfully market" them into taking on a lot of debt to obtain a vehicle way more expensive than they actually need.
I can tell you this: I need 4wd to get back to my fishing and hunting shack in the winter, it's about a mile down a private dirt road. I tow a 2500lb boat in the summer, haul my 3' X 6' pop up ice shanty every week in the winter, canoes, kayaks, and a dirt bike in the summer. On occasion I haul the small boat I leave at the cabin in the bed of my truck. Not to mention we get winter here and sometimes I need 4wd just to get around.
(05-14-2015, 09:21 AM)gstanford Wrote: Only fools purchase expensive cars anyway, there is precious little else in this world outside of computer parts that loses its value faster than cars do.So quick to pass judgement. Would you like it if I said, "Only students drive Yaris's. Successful people demand more safety, room, power, and style than a Yaris can manage, but we all have to make sacrifices before we get ahead in the world."?
(05-14-2015, 09:21 AM)gstanford Wrote: Keep going. We will very quickly get to the point where nobody will believe one syllable of anything you utter/write and it will be all your own doing.
First, you have to understand that for someone like me, the base model of a small truck does seem very primitive and Spartan.
Second, you've yet to prove any of my "lies" and others here have been pointing out your own lies and mistakes.
It was a big deal for me to buy a six cylinder truck, I researched it pretty thoroughly. (my last six were V8s)
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-14-2015
(05-14-2015, 05:30 PM)gstanford Wrote: The Toyota pickup I linked has a 4 liter V6 engine standard across the range (just like your truck). It does NOT have a 4 cylinder engine It has fake leather trim (just like your truck) it has computerized entertainment/GPS etc, etc. The only thing it doesn't have is 20" wheels (18" max).
You are clueless!
First, I have a 2015 5.3l Sierra now, I traded in the 4.3l Silverado three months ago.
Second, yes, you can get 6 cylinder truck with all the options of a V8 truck, but what does that prove? It's not a $20K vehicle anymore or close to it.
With the options my truck has, an extended cab Toyota Tacoma Extended cab costs $29, 408 MSRP, far above your $20K "sensibility cut off".
And you would still have a truck that can't haul my skiff, ice shanty, or my son's dirt bike with the tailgate closed. A truck that would have to work much harder to tow my boat. A truck that my 6'4" frame would be more cramped in, as well as my son and his friends we haul around.
You're the clueless one Greg.
Pretending subcompact cars and little toy trucks are acceptable transportation for families that can easily afford to have what they need, rather than settle for inconvenience.
The 75% of the top 20 selling vehicles here are in step with my thinking should have told you long ago that I think like most Americans. (and that the little car ways of Europe/Asia/Australia mean very little here- for us , small cars are something to be avoided)
RE: Texas Governor Deploys National Guard To Stave Off Obama Takeover - RolloTheGreat - 05-14-2015
(05-14-2015, 07:36 PM)gstanford Wrote:Not true. (a lie)Quote:Second, yes, you can get 6 cylinder truck with all the options of a V8 truck, but what does that prove? It's not a $20K vehicle anymore or close to it.
The V6, dashboard instrumentation and fake leather upholstery are standard across the line.
http://www.edmunds.com/toyota/tacoma/2015/?tab-id=reviews-tab#leaderboard-reviews-3-anchor
Quote:The standard four-cylinder engine provides decent performance...The cabin feels cheap in places with lots of hard plastic surfaces....engines provide decent fuel economy and power, they're pretty noisy when pushed for acceleration....
Look what is Optional:
Quote:2WD Double Cab adds power mirrors, adjustable driver lumbar,Wowee! Power mirrors and a manual seat!
Quote:The Access Cab is eligible for the Convenience package (called the Convenience Extra Value package on the Double Cab), which adds keyless entry, power mirrors (Access Cab only), cruise control, a tinted sliding rear window and steering-wheel audio controls.Up another level to get keyless entry and cruise control, and steering wheel audio.
Quote: The SR5 package includes those items plus chrome grille and rear bumper trim, color-keyed front bumper and fenders, foglights (V6 only), adjustable driver lumbar support (already standard on Double Cab), unique seat fabric, variable intermittent wipers, metallic-look instrument panel trim, a leather-wrapped steering wheel and (automatic-only) shift knob, dual sun visors with mirrors and extenders and a rearview camera.Top of the line to get stuff like a wrapped steering wheel, foglights, rear view camera, chrome bumpers.
Like I said, Tacomas SUCK in base trim and are basically caveman trucks.
(05-14-2015, 07:36 PM)gstanford Wrote: With the options my truck has, an extended cab Toyota Tacoma Extended cab costs $29, 408 MSRP, far above your $20K "sensibility cut off".[/quoteYep and getting far less. Much smaller, more dangerous in a wreck, and no 350hp/388ft lbs torque in a Taco.
Still far cheaper than your truck.
(05-14-2015, 07:36 PM)gstanford Wrote: Am I now? For what you paid for your truck I could have a nice car AND a nice truck. Why would I want to drive a truck around when I don't need to? I didn't grow up a Southern redneck HillBilly.
My parents have three bachelors and one Masters between them, all from Big 10 colleges. My dad ran and owned businesses my entire life. The only time we ever lived in the "hills" is when my folks bought a log home with a glass front on top of a bluff that overlooked the southern half of the state. I could see the lights of the city I live in now (45 miles away) from our hot tub at night.
If that is growing up a "Southern redneck Hillbilly" the world needs more of it.
In the USA, pickup trucks are the new luxury cars because people know they're safe and have a lot of utility. Before that it was big SUVs, which have a little less utility.
It was never a Taco or a Yaris.