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Coffee Lake Thread
Quote:In a bid to boost sales of its 200-series chipset motherboards and Core "Kaby Lake" processors, Intel is coordinating bundles of motherboards across brands with its Optane cache SSDs. Analysts predict that this could be an inventory-clearing exercise by Intel, because it plans to launch its next-generation Core "Coffee Lake" processors by late-August, 2017. "Coffee Lake" will see the introduction of six-core processor SKUs to Intel's mainstream-desktop platform, which is currently led by the quad-core i7-7700K "Kaby Lake."
Quote:At the time of that announcement, Intel said that Coffee Lake chips would offer at least 15% better performance than their predecessors. But today, alongside its unveiling of new high-performance X-Series processors for premium desktops - which include a new Core i9 Extreme Edition with 18 cores - Intel revealed that its 8th-gen chips are performing even better than expected.

The company said that in its latest testing of Coffee Lake, it's "seeing a performance improvement of more than 30 percent" compared with the current generation, based on a SYSmark benchmark. It did add the caveat that "performance estimates are Pre-Silicon and are subject to change", and that such projections have +/- 7% margin of error" - but given that its earlier predictions were based on the same benchmark, it's clear that Coffee Lake performance will still be considerably higher than Intel's initial estimates from February.

Intel didn't disclose any further details about its 8th-generation processors today, adding only that it will have "more to say in the future". Like Kaby Lake, the new chips will be built on a 14nm architecture, and remain on track for launch later this year.
Quote:During its keynote, Intel made a brief mention that its 8th generation processors offer up to 30% more performance than its 7th generation products. Of course, many took that to mean IPC-boosting architectural enhancements, but we don’t really know for sure, because Intel unfortunately didn’t provide any context during the keynote.

The press release was equally unclear, but we examined the footnotes and found that the hyperthreaded processors have twice the number of physical cores than the previous generation and a 500MHz increase to the TurboBoost clock. Doubling the number of cores within the same 15W TDP envelope is an impressive achievement, but it kind of takes the shine off of a mere 30% performance increase.

The catch? Intel didn’t run the tests on the final product it brought out on stage. Instead, the company used pre-silicon estimates that have a +/- 7% margin of error, so the final product may fall short of projections.

To Intel's credit, it could have emulated a heavily-threaded and unrealistic synthetic benchmark (Cinebench comes to mind) to expose a 50% performance delta, but instead chose to emulate real applications with the SYSmark application.

In either case, the next generation looks promising, but the newly-competitive CPU market might find us more closely reading through ambiguous announcements like these in the future as Intel and AMD jockey for the marketing edge.
Quote:Intel plans to launch this platform by August-September (before Q4 sets in), and it has one big difference - a new six-core part, based on the 8th generation Core "Coffee Lake" silicon. Built on a refined 14 nm process, the 6-core "Coffee Lake" chip could feature its TDP rating around the 95W mark for the "K" (multiplier unlocked) part. Quad-core parts could also be carved out of this silicon, with their TDP rated at 65W for the non-K (multiplier-locked) parts. AMD Ryzen 7 1700 eight-core chip with unlocked multipler is rated at 65W. Intel will follow up on its first-wave of "Coffee Lake" chips with additional quad-core and dual-core parts in Q1-2018, besides other 300-series chipsets (likely the H370 and B350).
Quote:What sets the 300-series chipset - at least the Z370 - apart from its predecessors, is that it integrates WLAN and USB 3.1 gen 2.0 controllers, which could hit the bottom-lines of third-party controller suppliers such as Realtek, Broadcom, and ASMedia, particularly hard.
As a clear indication that these features won't be restricted to the premium desktop Z370 platform, it is being reported that integrated WLAN and USB 3.1 could also feature on the company's entry-level "Gemini Lake" SoC, which succeeds "Apollo Lake." This move is part of Intel's drive to miniaturize the PCB footprint of the platform, so it could feature in low-power convertibles that compete with ones based on ARM SoCs, and is particularly important in the wake of Qualcomm courting Microsoft for a convertible that runs Win32 apps over emulated x86, a move that has irked Intel.
Quote:The part in question is a six-core processor, which appears identified as a Genuine Intel CPU 0000 (so, an engineering sample.) SiSoft Sandra identifies the processor as a Kaby Lake-S part, which is probably because Coffee Lake processors aren't yet supported. The details show us a 3.1 GHz base, and a 4.2 GHz boost clock, with a 256 Kb L2 cache per core and a total of 12 MB L3 (so, 2 MB per core, which is in-line with current Kaby Lake offerings.) The 6-core "Coffee Lake" silicon will be built on a highly-refined 14 nm node by Intel, with a die-size of 149 mm². Quad-core parts won't be carved out of this silicon by disabling two cores, but rather be built on a smaller 126 mm² die.
Quote:The leak comes straight from MSI where someone decided to keep their internet connection enabled during the benchmark run. The Coffee Lake 6 Core processor scored 4619 points in single-core and 20828 points in multi-core performance tests.

When compared to an AMD Ryzen 5 1600X, we note that this chip scores 4574 points in single core and 20769 points in multi-core tests which isn’t a huge difference but it should be noted that the Intel chip isn’t running at it’s retail speeds which will be higher and is still faster by a decent margin.
Quote:Acer Swift 3 will be one of the first models to sport the upcoming Core i5-8250U from the Coffee Lake generation by Intel. Despite being ultra thin (17.95 mm / 0.7″) and light (1.7 kg / 3.8 lbs), the 14-inch laptop is equipped with an NVIDIA GeForce MX150 discrete GPU (2GB GDDR5) and 8GBs of RAM. Another big advantage will be the PCIe NVMe storage (still unconfirmed) and the Full HD IPS screen.

However, the jewel in the crown is definitely the new Core i5-8250U which has four cores with 3.4 GHz Turbo Boost frequency and 6MBs of LL cache. It should provide decent performance even for casual photo / video editing and although the Swift 3 has DDR3 RAM, 8250U supports DDR4 at 2133 MHz.
Quote:The more interesting part of the report, though, is that Intel may be looking to basically dominate its entire i5 line-up with 6-core offerings, from the i5-8600K, towards the (usually lowly) 8400 processor. The main differentiating factor between the i5 and the i7 lineup of 6-core processors would be support for HyperThreading. The i5-8600K processor is said to be clocked at 3.6 GHz with the same TDP as the i7-8700K (95 W), while the i5-8400 would bring about a 2.8 GHz base clock and a 65 W TDP. This lends itself to a natural reasoning regarding the rest of Intel's lineup. Assuming the report is true, Intel's differentiation could go one of two ways: a further extension of its i5 lineup to lower digits (8300, 8200, and so forth) for its 4-core, 8-thread CPUs and pure quad-core processors for the i3 lineup; or, heaven forbid, quad-core, 8-thread processors being available on the top of Intel's i3 product stack. Personally, this editor doesn't see that happening. At least not yet.
Rumored lineup of 6-core Coffee Lake CPUs:
Quote:For now, all we know is that Intel’s Coffee Lake family of desktop processors are expected to launch sometime in the second half of 2017, and that it's built on a third-gen 14nm (14nm++) process. Given that Intel has, until this year, held its annual developer conference in the August timeframe (the company is now focused on smaller, more targeted events), the timing of the leaks (and possible release) also isn’t a big surprise. Sources have been telling us for weeks that Coffee Lake is coming before the summer ends.
Rumored 6C/6T Coffee Lake Core i5s:
SickBeast has already posted about this on BTR, Coffee Lake will not work with 200 series motherboards:
Coffee Lake will have 24 PCIe lanes:
First quad core i3:
More quad core i3s:
Coffee Lake unveiling on August 21:
More info on quad core i3s:
And a leak straight from an Intel event:
Rough idea of Coffee Lake pricing:
This platform looks like the most useful Intel upgrade in years. Probably since Sandy Bridge. These things are going to fly off the shelves. I've been thinking about Ryzen but I'm interested in Optane.
Low-power Coffee Lake CPUs revealed:
Coffee Lake box art:
Intel says the box art isn't correct:
Coffee Lake SiSoft SANDRA benchmarks:
Coffee Lake release date revealed:
Z390 chipset possibly revealed in leak:
Quad core i3s coming in first wave of Coffee Lake:
Geekbench results for i7-8700K:
Coffee Lake prices are not increasing much over their predecessors:
Quote:The fastest Ryzen 5 1600X is 5038 / 24751; the fastest result logged in Windows is 4862 / 22850. Geekbench’s results, however, should be taken with a grain of salt. I don’t normally use the test because I’ve never been enamored with it on desktops (and its mobile versions have also come in for their fair share of criticism). Geekbench scores also float a great deal, making it difficult to use the database to find a representative score for comparison. Collectively, these figures suggest that Coffee Lake will be a straightforward upgrade for Intel and its Core i7 family. Two more cores, slightly lower base clocks, and somewhat lower full-core turbo modes make for a potent multi-threaded boost, but limited single-threaded gains.

We’ll have to wait and see how competitive positioning shakes out, but AMD seems likely to keep its strong multi-threaded positioning. Intel’s single-threaded performance has been better than AMD’s from day one; the Core i7-7700K is still the fastest single-threaded CPU you can buy today. That hasn’t kept AMD from significantly improving its overall revenue so far this year, and a comparatively small boost to 12 threads at the top of Intel’s stack won’t change the Ryzen 5 1600X’s strong position around the $250 price point. If Intel wants to dethrone that core, it’ll need to cut the price on the i7-8700K by about $100, and that’s unlikely to happen.
Quote:A Eurocom representative, posting on NotebookReview forums, hinted at the possibility that the upcoming Intel Z390 Express chipset, which hits motherboards in 2018, could exclusively support 8-core/16-thread processors, which come out in the second half of 2018. The representative revealed this in context of the company skipping the Z370 Express chipset, as it lacks support for those upcoming 8-core/16-thread chips. In addition to support for new processors and possibly next-generation "Ice Lake" processors, the Z390 chipset adds several new features over the Z370, including a better onboard audio solution, integrated WLAN, and SDIO controller.
Quote:The 8-core processor Intel is planning to launch in the second half of 2018 will be based on the current 14 nanometer "Coffee Lake" micro-architecture, according to leaked XTU errata log. A curious looking change-log entry reads "[CFL] Added support for 8,2 core," where "CFL" is the three-letter contraction of "Coffee Lake," just as "KBL" stands for "Kaby Lake" and "HSW" for "Haswell."
Quote:A report out of Expreview says that users should expect Intel's 8700K 6-core processor to easily clock up to 4.8 GHz with conventional cooling methods. Apparently, the chip doesn't even need that much voltage to achieve this feat either; however, thermal constraints are quickly hit when pushing Intel's latest (upcoming) leader for the mainstream desktop parts. Expreview says that due to the much increased temperatures, users who want to eke out the most performance from their CPU purchase will likely have to try and resort to delidding of their 8700K. While that likely wouldn't have been necessary with Intel's 7700K processors, remember that here we have two extra CPU cores drawing power and producing waste heat, so it makes sense that thermals will be a bigger problem.
Intel officially announces the release date as October 5:
And the first review is out early:
Quote:Ahead of the 5th October reviews NDA, Lab501 posted their review of the Core i7-8700K six-core processor using samples not provided by Intel, paired with an Aorus Z370 Ultra Gaming motherboard. The tests reveal that the i7-8700K trades blows with the Ryzen 7 1800X in multi-threaded tests, despite two fewer cores, and has a clear leadership in single-threaded tests. It also reveals that the i7-8700K may not be as pricier than the i7-7700K as previously thought. Interestingly, the i7-8700K also spells trouble for "Skylake-X" Core i7 SKUs such as the i7-7800X and i7-7820X, as it offers multi-threaded performance in proximity to them, while being cheaper overall.
Quote:We were also told that the Z370 chipset is more of a stop-gap solution for immediate launch, and that Z370 contains trace optimizations for power delivery that are necessary to make Coffee Lake work well. This is the real reason that Coffee Lake isn’t meant to be compatible with Z200 chipsets. We learned through multiple sources that some earlier engineering boards supported intercompatibility between the products, but that this was eventually disabled in firmware to ensure Coffee Lake is used on platforms which have had their power delivery optimized properly. We learned that Z390 should carry with it greater performance improvements than found on Z370, but don’t have further information than that.
SweClockers says that they believe that Coffee Lake CPUs will be scarce until next year:
Quote:Despite a few missteps, Core i7-8700K lives up to Intel’s claims. While it doesn't beat the -7700K by a massive margin, the Coffee Lake flagship does deliver better performance in stock and overclocked form. Of course, adding a Z370 motherboard and competent cooler knocks you over the $400 mark, so be ready to pay for that privilege.

Value-seekers have to be asking if Core i7-8700K's price tag is even worth paying, then. After all, you can get Ryzen 7 1800X-class performance out of an overclocked Ryzen 7 1700 for $300 or less. But based on our matrix, Coffee Lake gives you the best performance (furthest to the right) without getting too crazy on price. We're naturally wondering how Core i5-8600K will fare. For now, though, Core i7-8700K is the gaming CPU to own.

Whereas Kaby Lake tends to fall behind Ryzen once we jump out of the games and start looking at rendering/encoding workloads, Coffee Lake's extra cores, higher clock rates, and overclocking headroom help close that gap. Applications previously notorious for going AMD's way are now more hotly contested.

Unfortunately, you will have to buy a new Z370-based motherboard to support Core i7-8700K. Coffee Lake necessarily breaks compatibility with the not-altogether-old Z270 chipset for higher memory data rates and improved power to the CPU's package. And of course, the Z-series platform controller hub is a requisite if you want access to unlocked ratio multipliers. Lower-end B- and H-series chipsets are coming, but not until next year.

We're also disappointed that Core i7-8700K still utilizes thermal paste between its die and heat spreader. Whereas this was a significant issue during our Skylake-X evaluation, though, it's not as problematic on a 95W CPU. You can easily stave off throttling with a heat sink and fan, or dial in a respectable overclock under a closed-loop liquid cooler.
It's an exciting year to be an enthusiast. Intel obviously planned to beef up its line-up years back, but we can thank AMD for the accelerated timeline and competitive pricing. Competition truly is a wonderful thing.
GamersNexus sums up the Coffee Lake release:
Quote:Availability is still a giant question mark, here, and may yet result in follow-up coverage as we determine the situation of presence of the product at retailers. Rumors indicate low quantities at launch, but we haven’t been able to firmly confirm those. For now, this conclusion is being written (albeit sparingly) under the assumption that you’re considering a purchase at MSRP ($~350-360), not some jacked-up price, and that the product is available. The 8700K does a lot of things well, but if it can’t be bought, it’s going to be another Vega situation. We’ll keep an eye on that throughout the day, and please let us know of what you spot at regional retailers.
Quote:This behavior shows why "multi-core enhancement" is undesirable: it's overclocking through and through, and it requires cooling to match. Builders who are buying heatsinks under the assumption they'll be facing all-core Turbo speeds of 4.3 GHz from the i7-8700K could be surprised if their motherboard tries to "help" by modifying Intel's factory Turbo Boost behavior. Our Gigabyte Z370 Aorus Gaming 7 test motherboard commendably ships with the feature disabled, but we'd imagine the feature could still catch both reviewers and builders alike off guard. We've been protesting this "feature" for years, and we'll continue to do so when it rears its head.
These are all rough benchmarks, but at the end of the day, Coffee Lake does seem to run hotter at stock speeds than the quad-core CPUs that have come before it. That's probably as it should be: there are two more cores and four more threads to deal with under the heat spreader. Builders planning to cool the chip at stock speeds should certainly be able to get away with an inexpensive cooler like a Hyper 212 Evo, but those hoping for a Prime95-stable overclock without a delid and repaste need to budget for a substantial liquid cooler. In that sense, the i7-8700K is no different than the Core i7-6700K and Core i7-7700K before it, and it's definitely harder to cool than AMD's Ryzen CPUs. AMD's chips all boast soldered heat spreaders, and metal is undeniably a better thermal transfer medium than paste.

The question of a paste-based TIM versus solder is almost certainly the largest variable in keeping Coffee Lake on ice relative to Ryzen CPUs, but I think there's more to it than that. First off, it's worth noting that Intel's implementation of AVX in the Skylake microarchitecture offers two 256-bit vector units per core, while the Zen architecture only offers two 128-bit-wide units per core. Skylake also has wider data paths that need more wires to implement, and that presumably means higher power usage when moving data around. When we run an intense AVX workload like Prime95, then, the stress test should unsurprisingly do more work, consume more power, and ultimately generate more heat on a chip that's capable of sustaining twice the SIMD throughput. It's certainly easier to cool an overclocked Ryzen CPU thanks to its soldered heat spreader, but it's hard to argue that one isn't getting more out of overclocking the Core i7-8700K in many tasks despite its higher temperatures. That fact should be part of the value consideration when setting out to overclock either chip.

Whether Intel is doing the best it can to support overclocking on its chips through its thermal interface material of choice is another question, and it's one that's raged since Ivy Bridge and coursed through Devil's Canyon. Coffee Lake doesn't do anything to quench the flames. Folks seeking the lowest load temperatures and highest possible overclocking headroom from Coffee Lake chips will likely need to reach for liquid-metal TIM, their delid tool of choice, and a hefty liquid cooler or giant tower heatsink. At stock speeds, though, the i7-8700K should be fine with the same Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo that's graced countless systems. Just be sure to terminate any multi-core enhancement settings in your motherboard's firmware with extreme prejudice first.
Quote:Newegg has apparently ordered over 3000 units fo the Core i7 8700K alone to keep pace with demand (these have been well-received chips as you can see on TPU's own reviews), and expects these to come in at around a "3 to 5 weeks" time-frame. What separates This availability problem from being simply an issue of overly high demand is that Intel's Coffee Lake processors were already expected to be limited in availability even before they were launched. Remember that while Intel probably had such six-core processors as these taped out well in advance already, they did pull up their launch window so as to better compete with current AMD Ryzen offerings.
Tom's is saying that it was supposedly Amazon that ordered 3,000+ Coffee Lake CPUs:
Quote:This decision is a rollback that does little more than rob users of another data point that has really always been there. The practical effect of this change isn't anything to write home about: Intel's Turbo Boost capabilities were never guaranteed performance levels (the fact that the advertised Turbo speeds were called "Max Turbo" implied Turbo levels could be lower.) However, there's also not much that can be said to explain this change in stance from the blue giant. If anything, this decision only opens up debate and speculation regarding the reasons why Intel is making this change: and the skeptics among us will always default to foul play or dark linings.

For one, it could be said that Intel is doing this in order to unlock a lot more leeway in CPU binning. Absent all-core turbo speeds means that Intel now only has to guarantee two levels of performance for each of its chips: all-core base clocks (which for the 8700K, for example, is set at 3.7 GHz), and single-core Turbo (a more impressive 4.3 GHz). These are the only frequencies Intel now has to make sure all of their 8700K chips hit. This gives a whole new weight to the "silicon lottery" concept, in that now users can be saddled with the most basic 8700K that only achieves an all-core clock of just 3.7 GHz and not a switch more, or an amazing chip that hits 5.3 GHz easily.

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