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Gravity Payments CEO Dan Price cuts his salary from $1m to $70k, doubles staff wages
#41
(11-19-2016, 08:01 PM)RolloTheGreat Wrote:
(11-19-2016, 11:07 AM)gstanford Wrote: Its my thread I'll post what I please in it.

It is a wonderfully entertaining tale of woe for indian rich bastards and I'm glad the poor get sit back and snigger at them.  The Indian PM was wise to bring in the law that brought this about.

How admirable, you revel in the government stealing money people have earned for their families. You are a class act, GStan.
Anti-taxer detected.
Valve hater, Nintendo hater, Microsoft defender, AMD hater, Google Fiber hater, 4K lover, net neutrality lover.
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#42
(11-19-2016, 08:01 PM)RolloTheGreat Wrote:
(11-19-2016, 11:07 AM)gstanford Wrote: Its my thread I'll post what I please in it.

It is a wonderfully entertaining tale of woe for indian rich bastards and I'm glad the poor get sit back and snigger at them.  The Indian PM was wise to bring in the law that brought this about.

How admirable, you revel in the government stealing money people have earned for their families. You are a class act, GStan.

The government owns the money, which it issues. Therefore it can't be stealing.

The rich have no right to hoard money at the expense of the poor, and the rich don't earn money either, they unfairly gain it through access to natural resources that others don't enjoy (provided by their rich and powerful buddies in power).

Nice to see some of their filthy lucre go up in smoke, not like it was doing them any good anyway, hoarded away so noone could benefit from it as it was.
Adam knew he should have bought a PC but Eve fell for the marketing hype.

Homeopathy is what happened when snake oil salesmen discovered that water is cheaper than snake oil.

The reason they call it the American Dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it. -- George Carlin
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#43
All they have to do is shut down all the off shore bank accounts and make the rich actually pay tax. Right now they don't. The tax revenue from that money could solve all of the world's problems.
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#44
(11-19-2016, 11:52 PM)SickBeast Wrote: All they have to do is shut down all the off shore bank accounts and make the rich actually pay tax. Right now they don't. The tax revenue from that money could solve all of the world's problems.



http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/201...o-be-fair/

Gosh, and the top 2.7% of people are already paying 51.6% of the tax here now, and the bottom 62% are paying a whole 5%!

If only those darn rich people would pay their fair share, which apparently to you guys is all of the tax.

Hit_head
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#45
(11-20-2016, 01:34 AM)RolloTheGreat Wrote:
(11-19-2016, 11:52 PM)SickBeast Wrote: All they have to do is shut down all the off shore bank accounts and make the rich actually pay tax. Right now they don't. The tax revenue from that money could solve all of the world's problems.



http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/201...o-be-fair/

Gosh, and the top 2.7% of people are already paying 51.6% of the tax here now, and the bottom 62% are paying a whole 5%!

If only those darn rich people would pay their fair share, which apparently to you guys is all of the tax.

Hit_head

No, we don't want rich people to pay all the tax. We want them to pay their fair share, which means:

Stop tax avoidance through the various schemes that are in use and pay the percentage of tax on your income and assets that legislation says you have to pay.

Preferably we would also roll back tax cuts to pre-Reagan levels and roll back the legislation that treats corporations as people in the eyes of the law.
Adam knew he should have bought a PC but Eve fell for the marketing hype.

Homeopathy is what happened when snake oil salesmen discovered that water is cheaper than snake oil.

The reason they call it the American Dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it. -- George Carlin
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#46
(11-20-2016, 04:59 PM)gstanford Wrote: No, we don't want rich people to pay all the tax.  We want them to pay their fair share, which means:

Stop tax avoidance through the various schemes that are in use and pay the percentage of tax on your income and assets that legislation says you have to pay.

Preferably we would also roll back tax cuts to pre-Reagan levels and roll back the legislation that treats corporations as people in the eyes of the law.
To achieve the latter, you would also need to roll back a lot of Supreme Court precedent.
Valve hater, Nintendo hater, Microsoft defender, AMD hater, Google Fiber hater, 4K lover, net neutrality lover.
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#47
(11-20-2016, 01:34 AM)RolloTheGreat Wrote:
(11-19-2016, 11:52 PM)SickBeast Wrote: All they have to do is shut down all the off shore bank accounts and make the rich actually pay tax. Right now they don't. The tax revenue from that money could solve all of the world's problems.



http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/201...o-be-fair/

Gosh, and the top 2.7% of people are already paying 51.6% of the tax here now, and the bottom 62% are paying a whole 5%!

If only those darn rich people would pay their fair share, which apparently to you guys is all of the tax.

Hit_head
I guess you missed the part where Donald Trump didn't pay any tax for 18 years or something. Why do you think he didn't release his tax returns? Now he wants to cut corporate taxes which will make his family even richer. That could have been his entire motivation to become president. To lower his own taxes and make himself even richer. The rich will get richer under Trump. It's disgusting. And yet her campaigned as a champion of the middle class. It's a total sham IMO. Bernie Sanders was the only champion of the middle class. But your corrupt system would not allow him to become president.
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#48
(11-20-2016, 10:20 PM)SickBeast Wrote: I guess you missed the part where Donald Trump didn't pay any tax for 18 years or something. Why do you think he didn't release his tax returns? Now he wants to cut corporate taxes which will make his family even richer. That could have been his entire motivation to become president. To lower his own taxes and make himself even richer. The rich will get richer under Trump. It's disgusting. And yet her campaigned as a champion of the middle class. It's a total sham IMO. Bernie Sanders was the only champion of the middle class. But your corrupt system would not allow him to become president.

I don't consider Donald Trump "the rich" and understand there are people who skirt tax laws at all levels.

I also understand the rich pay most of the tax.
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#49
(11-20-2016, 10:36 PM)RolloTheGreat Wrote:
(11-20-2016, 10:20 PM)SickBeast Wrote: I guess you missed the part where Donald Trump didn't pay any tax for 18 years or something. Why do you think he didn't release his tax returns? Now he wants to cut corporate taxes which will make his family even richer. That could have been his entire motivation to become president. To lower his own taxes and make himself even richer. The rich will get richer under Trump. It's disgusting. And yet her campaigned as a champion of the middle class. It's a total sham IMO. Bernie Sanders was the only champion of the middle class. But your corrupt system would not allow him to become president.

I don't consider Donald Trump "the rich" and understand there are people who skirt tax laws at all levels.

I also understand the rich pay most of the tax.
I just don't see how anyone in their right mind can think that offshore tax evasion is somehow a good thing.
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#50
(11-20-2016, 10:47 PM)SickBeast Wrote: I just don't see how anyone in their right mind can think that offshore tax evasion is somehow a good thing.

I just don't see how anyone in their right mind can think anyone said offshore tax evasion is a good thing.

I only said there are tax cheaters at all levels and that the top 2% already pay over half the tax.

Some would consider that "their fair share" as a group.

The bottom 50% don't pay federal tax.

I'd call them more the problem than the top 2%
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#51
(11-21-2016, 12:03 AM)RolloTheGreat Wrote:
(11-20-2016, 10:47 PM)SickBeast Wrote: I just don't see how anyone in their right mind can think that offshore tax evasion is somehow a good thing.

I just don't see how anyone in their right mind can think anyone said offshore tax evasion is a good thing.

I only said there are tax cheaters at all levels and that the top 2% already pay over half the tax.

Some would consider that "their fair share" as a group.

The bottom 50% don't pay federal tax.

I'd call them more the problem than the top 2%
Well how do propose we help them without socialism? Because your solution seems like it is to give the rich even more money. Do you think the poor people want to be poor? They don't. They are trapped by the system in a lot of cases. There are a lot of barriers in the USA that keep the rich rich and the poor poor.
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#52
(11-21-2016, 01:58 AM)SickBeast Wrote: Well how do propose we help them without socialism? Because your solution seems like it is to give the rich even more money. Do you think the poor people want to be poor? They don't. They are trapped by the system in a lot of cases. There are a lot of barriers in the USA that keep the rich rich and the poor poor.

Workfare. I would route all assistance through factories as wages and benefits and have them do low skill work to make us things like socks and plastic bowls.

They'd still be poor, but the profits on their products would help pay for their benefits and create other jobs.
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#53
Not a bad idea. However without progressive taxation the poor are screwed. That being said I think a flat tax with absolutely no loopholes and no offshore accounts would benefit everyone and the government would probably come out ahead.
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#54
(11-21-2016, 02:59 AM)SickBeast Wrote: Not a bad idea. However without progressive taxation the poor are screwed. That being said I think a flat tax with absolutely no loopholes and no offshore accounts would benefit everyone and the government would probably come out ahead.

We have a highly progressive tax.

What I'd also like to see is the 50% who pay nothing pay something, even if it's just a little. (E.G. Make $500/week? Pay $50 a month tax)

The poor should have some stake in their maintenance.
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#55
(11-21-2016, 06:37 AM)RolloTheGreat Wrote:
(11-21-2016, 02:59 AM)SickBeast Wrote: Not a bad idea. However without progressive taxation the poor are screwed. That being said I think a flat tax with absolutely no loopholes and no offshore accounts would benefit everyone and the government would probably come out ahead.

We have a highly progressive tax.

What I'd also like to see is the 50% who pay nothing pay something, even if it's just a little. (E.G. Make $500/week? Pay $50 a month tax)

The poor should have some stake in their maintenance.
I think it's more important to see the rich pay tax on all the money they have stashed away in offshore accounts. Think of all the money that will flow through the economy if they shut down all those accounts. It's total nonsense and I'm shocked that it has been going on for so I unfettered.
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#56
Quote:The rich have no right to hoard money at the expense of the poor

Are you a pure communist or rabid corporatist? Honest question.

Quote:they unfairly gain it through access to natural resources that others don't enjoy


In India this may have some validity, outside of that none of the major powers in the modern industrial world can make this claim. Emerging markets sure, but certainly not the heaviest hitters in global finance.

Quote:Preferably we would also roll back tax cuts to pre-Reagan levels and roll back the legislation that treats corporations as people in the eyes of the law.



Pre Reagan tax rates were catastrophic for the working class in the US, you won't find an idiot in Washington DC that isn't a socialist that would even attempt to pretend otherwise- Clinton and Obama never even proposed getting remotely close to that in their most extreme stances ever. Also, totally confused why you would want to take that right away from corporations while every other stance you have seems to worship the corporations as the lord of all they survey?

Quote:All they have to do is shut down all the off shore bank accounts and make the rich actually pay tax.

The rich off shoring money is insignificant. The most outrageous claim I have seen put the number at $32 trillion over the course of decades, if all of that were taxed properly it would work out to about $188 Billion a year *GLOBALLY*.  In other words, that would cover roughly half of the US's trade deficit with China- and that sum would need to be split up between all of the governments in the world.

Quote:The tax revenue from that money could solve all of the world's problems.


The US's share wouldn't come close to covering the interest on our national debt- hell the entire world's lost tax revenue wouldn't come close to covering the interest on US debt.

Quote:I just don't see how anyone in their right mind can think that offshore tax evasion is somehow a good thing.

Getting the Lemmings to argue about such things and ignore that Apple is going to create more profit this year than the top 100 people in the world combined- that's good left wing policy. 

Quote:There are a lot of barriers in the USA that keep the rich rich and the poor poor.


Could you please give an example, I would love to hear it. The rich tend to stay rich because they pay someone who isn't an idiot to handle their money. The poor frequently stay poor because they are idiots and handling their own money. The middle is what I'm worried about- the leftist agenda of centralized corporate power has destroyed the middle class in many developed nations, and you people insist on making it even worse.

Quote:Think of all the money that will flow through the economy if they shut down all those accounts.


Advancing the corporate agenda I see....

What happens when the wealthy are forced to take their cash out of off shore accounts, pay tax and move it back in to the US? It goes into the stock market which increases corporate valuation. The left seems to exist solely to benefit corporations at this point- not saying that the right is immune by any stretch of the imagination but is there any political policy the left are advancing that doesn't benefit corporations the most?
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#57
You think Bernie Sanders likes corporations? He agrees with Trump in that respect.

Also, the barriers I am talking about are mostly around health care and education. You can't find a job without them. And in the USA only the rich receive both.
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#58
Are you expecting an answer beyond "Rubbish! They're rich, of course they're evil!" from GStan, Ben?
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#59
Quote:You think Bernie Sanders likes corporations?

If he doesn't love them in a profound fashion, he's an idiot with his policies.

Quote:Also, the barriers I am talking about are mostly around health care and education.


I don't know if it is possible for a student to be denied loans, I've never heard of it happening(I suppose it must), education is available to everyone here, the question is if you are willing to work to pay for it. That is, in no way, a barrier. Yes, kids who have college paid for them have an advantage, but it isn't in the acquisition of an education, it is the part that comes after they graduate where they aren't even. That is a fundamental and important distinction.

Quote:You can't find a job without them.


I have never heard of a single employer, ever, in the US expecting someone to have their own insurance prior to working for them. Never even considered it a possibility, companies pay for health insurance here, that is how it works- even for the overwhelming majority of whom you guys consider rich. So no, not a barrier at all.

Quote:And in the USA only the rich receive both.


A very close friend of the family started with a new company- the same one I currently work for, about a decade ago. He is not now nor has he ever been close to 'rich'. At the time these events went down, he was still eligible for EIC(tax kick back for the working poor in the US). His son was diagnosed with stage 4 Lymphoma- a working poor man. After the diagnosis he was sent to several different treatment facilities and all of them failed- we were going to lose this child. Then he was informed of an experimental procedure only being done at one hospital anywhere in the world on children(used a stem cell/blood spinning/crash immune system repeat over and over then blitzkrieg). His son underwent this treatment and is entering his senior year of high school perfectly healthy. It is no exaggeration to say he would have died *anywhere* else in the world except for the US. By the time the study was published he would have been dead for a couple of years if he was under your health care system. Yes, some absurdly rich people got that shit rolling- no doubt- but once they paid the obscene costs to fund the study, the treatment itself was 'affordable' enough that my good friend was able to have his son partake without going into massive debt. There are some downsides to the way we do things, but if we change the whole world will suffer(R&D will plummet).
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#60
(11-21-2016, 08:20 AM)BenSkywalker Wrote:
Quote:The rich have no right to hoard money at the expense of the poor

Are you a pure communist or rabid corporatist? Honest question.

Quote:they unfairly gain it through access to natural resources that others don't enjoy


In India this may have some validity, outside of that none of the major powers in the modern industrial world can make this claim. Emerging markets sure, but certainly not the heaviest hitters in global finance.

Quote:Preferably we would also roll back tax cuts to pre-Reagan levels and roll back the legislation that treats corporations as people in the eyes of the law.



Pre Reagan tax rates were catastrophic for the working class in the US, you won't find an idiot in Washington DC that isn't a socialist that would even attempt to pretend otherwise- Clinton and Obama never even proposed getting remotely close to that in their most extreme stances ever. Also, totally confused why you would want to take that right away from corporations while every other stance you have seems to worship the corporations as the lord of all they survey?

Quote:All they have to do is shut down all the off shore bank accounts and make the rich actually pay tax.

The rich off shoring money is insignificant. The most outrageous claim I have seen put the number at $32 trillion over the course of decades, if all of that were taxed properly it would work out to about $188 Billion a year *GLOBALLY*.  In other words, that would cover roughly half of the US's trade deficit with China- and that sum would need to be split up between all of the governments in the world.

Quote:The tax revenue from that money could solve all of the world's problems.


The US's share wouldn't come close to covering the interest on our national debt- hell the entire world's lost tax revenue wouldn't come close to covering the interest on US debt.

Quote:I just don't see how anyone in their right mind can think that offshore tax evasion is somehow a good thing.

Getting the Lemmings to argue about such things and ignore that Apple is going to create more profit this year than the top 100 people in the world combined- that's good left wing policy. 

Quote:There are a lot of barriers in the USA that keep the rich rich and the poor poor.


Could you please give an example, I would love to hear it. The rich tend to stay rich because they pay someone who isn't an idiot to handle their money. The poor frequently stay poor because they are idiots and handling their own money. The middle is what I'm worried about- the leftist agenda of centralized corporate power has destroyed the middle class in many developed nations, and you people insist on making it even worse.

Quote:Think of all the money that will flow through the economy if they shut down all those accounts.


Advancing the corporate agenda I see....

What happens when the wealthy are forced to take their cash out of off shore accounts, pay tax and move it back in to the US? It goes into the stock market which increases corporate valuation. The left seems to exist solely to benefit corporations at this point- not saying that the right is immune by any stretch of the imagination but is there any political policy the left are advancing that doesn't benefit corporations the most?

What a crock!

I am pro-business -- pro small business that employs locals and circulates money through the local economy. Something altogether different from the "business" large corporations practice.
Adam knew he should have bought a PC but Eve fell for the marketing hype.

Homeopathy is what happened when snake oil salesmen discovered that water is cheaper than snake oil.

The reason they call it the American Dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it. -- George Carlin
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#61
(11-21-2016, 03:26 PM)gstanford Wrote: What a crock!

I am pro-business -- pro small business that employs locals and circulates money through the local economy.  Something altogether different from the "business" large corporations practice.

A. Big business is an indispensable part of the economy for multiple reasons. Better wages and benefits for employees, big part of the tax base (whether through direct income tax or tax on income of employees), and international business brings wealth into the country. Not to mention small companies don't have the resources to develop things like CPUs, jet air planes, and operating systems.

B. Big business and it's employees are vital consumers of the goods small business produces.


C. Big business produces the goods small businesses like your PC shop sells.

D. Big businesses are the stability of an economy and country.

E. Big businesses produces the weapons that defend a country.

You would have us living in the early 1800s making our own candles!

Like Ben said, you should bow down and thank big business, not yell about how you are subjugated by it.
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#62
GStanomics: "If everyone sets up their own one man business we will live in paradise, no more evil corporations! We'll all just barter the goods we produce among one another. A bloke might have to trade Apoppin a pork chop to read his latest video card review of the video cards they used to make, or another might fix my toilet in exchange for me installing a used hard drive he bartered for."
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#63
(11-22-2016, 12:17 AM)RolloTheGreat Wrote: GStanomics: "If everyone sets up their own one man business we will live in paradise, no more evil corporations! We'll all just barter the goods we produce among one another. A bloke might have to trade Apoppin a pork chop to read his latest video card review of the video cards they used to make, or another might fix my toilet in exchange for me installing a used hard drive he bartered for."

I love how you say that as though it is somehow a bad thing, but the simple reality is that this is the way things have been done world-wide for thousands of years. It has only been since the industrial revolution and the last 90 years or so that things have changed and the greed of the rich has spiraled out of control.
Adam knew he should have bought a PC but Eve fell for the marketing hype.

Homeopathy is what happened when snake oil salesmen discovered that water is cheaper than snake oil.

The reason they call it the American Dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it. -- George Carlin
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#64
(11-20-2016, 10:20 PM)SickBeast Wrote: I guess you missed the part where Donald Trump didn't pay any tax for 18 years or something. Why do you think he didn't release his tax returns? Now he wants to cut corporate taxes which will make his family even richer. That could have been his entire motivation to become president. To lower his own taxes and make himself even richer. The rich will get richer under Trump. It's disgusting. And yet her campaigned as a champion of the middle class. It's a total sham IMO. Bernie Sanders was the only champion of the middle class. But your corrupt system would not allow him to become president.

The claim trump paid no taxes in 20 years was just a smear tactic and although many went off to claim it as fact, there is no proof at all of that. You must also consider that the same sources promoting such unfounded claims also all take the same position by further claiming he is not anywhere rich as he claims he is. This is important for a couple reasons, one being how they come to such a conclusion using a suspiciously leaked 1995 return. Its pretty radical how they have the ability to see 20 yrs into the future looking at this one tax return, I wish we all had that ability. If you haven't put two and two together yet, they have to claim that he is nowhere near as rich as he reported..it simply doesn't add up otherwise..And truly, they are making a bunch of stuff up to force this together.. Stuff that they have no proof of at all. Stuff that is far fetched.

The 2nd thing here is who leaked the 95 tax return. And why this particular one? Obviously if it is real then someone had access to his tax returns. This one, in particular, he had a pretty large loss reported. The loss is from dealings he did in the 80s. This return would become the basis for the new york Times article and the origins of the claim he paid no races in 20 yrs.

But again, why did only this one return get leaked? Why not several from that period? Its very suspicious and the most reasonable answer I can come up with is: that this particular one was perfect for the attack they were trying to launch.

Its no secret that much of the media had it out for trump. Since the election, people have come forth from these outlets to say that they had decided to leave all professional journalism aside and the goal was to stop trump cause he was bad. That the truth was not a priority and that they had truly decided to blindly go after him at all cost.

The no tax story was more likely an attempt to bait trump. His ego, they knew well. And claims he isnt as rich as he says, that should really get under his skin. Its far fetched, they were claiming he is nowhere near as wealthy. That he was at a fraction of his claims.

But, this claim..The taxes.. Saying his businesses didnt exist, which he later showed the products a victory press conference- these were all bait attempts. Cause they really really really wanted his tax returns. And those are all things his returns would have addressed.

As for the returns, it could be true that he never paid taxes this whole time. But the new york Times version is complete fantasy..at best. They made it all up. They even had to make up more bizarre things to suppprt it, like he isnt a billionaire.

It could be that he didnt pay taxes, as a developer there are many write offs and many losses to claim.. As long as you are still building an empire, there are a lot write offs for real estate developers. They build places that people work in. Many locations give big tax breaks for stuff like that.

Its everyday.

But there is all these other things in the trump empire. He makes money a lot of ways.
He is likely to have had to pay taxes, more likely even. There are countless reasons why he wouldnt want to show his returns, worse even than the claim he hasnt paid taxes.. Which, I would find even more likely. Because, once the accusations of no races in 20yrs came out..He took that blow. So still, he withheld.

But, there are so many reasons. Maybe ties to people he didnt want out there. And it might not even be bad, but just politically suicide for him as a republican candidate. Say, he gave huge money to liberals or whatnot.

Or, imagine if this audit has caught something..or he thinks it will. It might not even be a purposeful act, but there could be a mess there. Something that he would be nailed to the wall if the media got a hold of it.

He could be guilty of trying to cover up stuff, or it really could be things that arent pretty...like perhaps he took a major hit recently and lost big time on something. The media would prosecute him, burn him at the stake over something like that. Or perhaps, the last real possibility..the trump university case against him. Perhaps he has an audit and a lawsuit. Perhaps his tax returns could be used in the lawsuit against him..

Or...endless other things.

This isnt a politician. He has a massive empire. He has his hands in thousands of places. Although he would get the blame personally for every mishap, he can not be pulling ever lever in every thing in the trump empire. Normally other people run all the different branches. And the top comes in when they screw something up.
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#65
(11-22-2016, 06:53 AM)gstanford Wrote:
(11-22-2016, 12:17 AM)RolloTheGreat Wrote: GStanomics: "If everyone sets up their own one man business we will live in paradise, no more evil corporations! We'll all just barter the goods we produce among one another. A bloke might have to trade Apoppin a pork chop to read his latest video card review of the video cards they used to make, or another might fix my toilet in exchange for me installing a used hard drive he bartered for."

I love how you say that as though it is somehow a bad thing, but the simple reality is that this is the way things have been done world-wide for thousands of years.  It has only been since the industrial revolution and the last 90 years or so that things have changed and the greed of the rich has spiraled out of control.

If we go back to one man businesses most will starve.
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#66
No, most won't starve, they didn't in the past and won't now.

Seond I said small business, not one man business. The one man business is bullshit of your own making, not mine!
Adam knew he should have bought a PC but Eve fell for the marketing hype.

Homeopathy is what happened when snake oil salesmen discovered that water is cheaper than snake oil.

The reason they call it the American Dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it. -- George Carlin
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