[ABT Exclusive]TMobile’s "Project Emerald" is HTC Glacier, has a dual-core Snapdragon CPU, three times faster than EVO 4G and benchmarks!

UPDATE: HTC Glacier seems to have been removed from the GLBenchmark website results database. But all the pictures here show the results and details that were available on it.

NOTE: The benchmark results below are for “GLBenchmark Pro ES 1.1 CPU Skinning” which is a CPU test. From the official description of this test, we believe that this test uses software skinning for character animation which is calculated entirely on the CPU. This would make this a test of the device’s CPU and not the GPU.

With the evidence that we present to you below we can safely say now that TMobile’s fabled “Project Emerald” is in fact the rumored HTC Glacier. HTC Glacier might be a codename for internal testing, and may change before release but we can safely agree on few important details about the hardware.

While browsing the GLBenchmark 1.1 results database, I came across a curious result for a device name I had not heard previously, the “HTC Glacier”. The benchmark score is very impressive for a HTC Device, as no other top 1 GHz Snapdragon smartphone is anywhere near this result. Have a look at the score compares to few of the other top smartphones and the venerable HTC G1 that started it all for Android.

tmobileprojectemeraldgla thumb [ABT Exclusive]TMobiles "Project Emerald" is HTC Glacier, has a dual core Snapdragon CPU, three times faster than EVO 4G and benchmarks!

tmobileprojectemeraldht thumb [ABT Exclusive]TMobiles "Project Emerald" is HTC Glacier, has a dual core Snapdragon CPU, three times faster than EVO 4G and benchmarks!

(Click on Image to enlarge)

Recently, Qualcomm issued a press release that it had begun sampling the third-generation dual-core Snapdragon’s to partners. Now, it’s well known that HTC uses Qualcomm chipsets and SOCs in it’s smartphones which would put it in a prime position to receive these new snapdragons from Qualcomm.

So why do we believe that HTC Glacier contains this new dual-core Snapdragon ?

Look at the EVO 4G (powered by a 1 GHz Snapdragon) score on the CPU test, 516 frames. The HTC Glacier’s score is 1432 frames which is around three times that of HTC’s fastest device at present. This can only be achieved by a dual core CPU.

So which Snapdragon is it ? Dual-Core 1.5 GHz or Dual-core 1.2 GHz ?

Let’s assume that the score would increase linearly with clock speed of the CPU and would double for 2 cores.

Scenario 1:

So, let’s assume that the HTC Glacier has the new dual core 1.2 GHz Snapdragon. Multiply 516 by 1.2 to get the score for a single core and multiply with 2 since the CPU has two cores. Here’s the math below in a nutshell.

Score from a 1 GHz core = 516 frames

Assumed score from a 1.2 GHz core = 516 x 1.2 => 619.2 frames

Assumed score from two 1.2 GHz cores = 619.2 x 2 => 1238.4 frames

Difference between real score and assumed score = 1432 – 1238.4 => 193.6 frames

These extra 193.6 frames could have come from architecture tweaks made by Qualcomm to it’s Snapdragon CPU.

Scenario 2:

So, let’s assume that the HTC Glacier has the new dual core 1.5 GHz Snapdragon. Multiply 516 by 1.5 to get the score for a single core and multiply with 2 since the CPU has two cores. Here’s the math below in a nutshell.

Score from a 1 GHz core = 516 frames

Assumed score from a 1.5 GHz core = 516 x 1.2 => 774 frames

Assumed score from two 1.2 GHz cores = 774 x 2 => 1548 frames

Difference between real score and assumed score = 1432 – 1548 => -116 frames

So by the above scenario, the score is lacking by 116 frames. This could be explained that the benchmark might not be able to take full advantage of both cores and might need some work on optimizing it for dual core architecture.

It is interesting to note how close the score of the single-core Hummingbird processor in the Samsung Vibrant is to this new dual-core Snapdragon processor.

How can we say this is T-Mobile’s Project Emerald ?

We do not have explicit confirmation on this, but our investigation has lead us to believe that this phone is definitely headed to T-Mobile. The rumors that we have heard from people and around the internet have indicated that “Project Emerald” is a dual-core CPU HTC device, which is why we are putting our money on HTC Glacier to be the “Project Emerald” device.

The user that uploaded the results for this phone to GLBenchmark.com, used the username “mbibik”. Have a look at the history of devices tested by”mbibik”.

tmobileprojectemeraldhtc thumb [ABT Exclusive]TMobiles "Project Emerald" is HTC Glacier, has a dual core Snapdragon CPU, three times faster than EVO 4G and benchmarks!

(Click on Image to enlarge)

All the previous devices tested by this user have two things in common. They are made by HTC and are sold by T-Mobile in the USA. A quick search for “mbibik tmobile” brings up few results, one of which is the this LinkedIn profile of “Mike Bibik”.

tmobileprojectemeraldlin thumb [ABT Exclusive]TMobiles "Project Emerald" is HTC Glacier, has a dual core Snapdragon CPU, three times faster than EVO 4G and benchmarks!

And Voila! Mike works at T-Mobile. So all this evidence points to HTC Glacier arriving on the T-Mobile in the near future. Given HTC’s latest success with big screen phones (HTC HD2, EVO 4G are sold out everywhere), I would expect this to continue the trend especially with the HD2 being discontinued on T-Mobile.

Here’s more info about the HTC Glacier.

htcglaciereglinfob thumb [ABT Exclusive]TMobiles "Project Emerald" is HTC Glacier, has a dual core Snapdragon CPU, three times faster than EVO 4G and benchmarks!

htcglaciertmobilesystem thumb [ABT Exclusive]TMobiles "Project Emerald" is HTC Glacier, has a dual core Snapdragon CPU, three times faster than EVO 4G and benchmarks!

htcglaciereglinfo thumb [ABT Exclusive]TMobiles "Project Emerald" is HTC Glacier, has a dual core Snapdragon CPU, three times faster than EVO 4G and benchmarks!

(Click on Image to enlarge)

Source: AlienBabelTech.com

For a detailed analysis on the Snapdragon, Hummingbird and OMAP architecture please read the following articles.

Hummingbird vs. Snapdragon: The 1 GHz Smartphone Showdown

Ruminations on various benchmarks for the OMAP 3600s, Hummingbird, and Snapdragon

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47 Responses

  1. jj says:

    it would be funny is this doesn’t go to T-Mobile. Like all the hot phones leave us.
    Yeah it’s rumored, but it ain’t true.
    Verizon gets the Droids (Motorola is like their bitch)
    Sprint gets the Epic 4G and don’t forget the Evo with FFC
    At&t well they have the blackberry torch, iphone (damnit)
    T-Mobile has, the fucking MyTouch (WTF!) YEah we got the vibrant, but so does everybody else. I prefer the sprint version.
    I miss the old T-Mobile. Those were the days. The service coverage was like BAMM! G1 every one was like Ohhh, the Sidekick was Teens CRAVING, The Wing, The OH Catherine Zeta-Jones ads, Where is that T-Mobile? We Gave Android its fucking NAME! The phone makers don’t care about us.
    HTC-Hey Moto
    Moto-Yeah
    HTC-Lets go make a hot ass phones
    Moto-Lets but some android, yeah
    Moto-I got the Droid line
    HTC-I got the incredible, evo, aria, etc.
    HTC-Where should we send them
    Moto-I don’t know about you, but More ppl, more sales I’m heading to Verizon
    HTC-T-Mobile made android fame
    Moto-So, but it hurts you
    Moto-Lets forget bout them
    HTC-No, we got to be nice, give them something
    Moto-Ugg, here the motorola Cliq
    HTC-I’ll give them the HD2
    HTC-What? don’t worry, I’ll give them windows mobile instead and no upgrade
    Moto-oh okay
    HTC-I just go to promise the contract and give them some android device like the G1
    Moto- Oh the MyTouch, show it out to teens, they got some g1 you know
    HTC-Yeah
    Months Later….
    HTC-Damn, the HD2 is selling
    Moto-yup, hmmm
    Htc-O_o
    Moto-Droid is the new hot cake
    HTC- Oh I got something
    weeks later..
    HTC-I show you the EVO the same as the HD2, but with 8mp dual flash, FFc, and 4G!!!
    MOTO- O.O
    HTC-New hot cakes.
    Moto-what about the folks at T,
    HTC-hmm the myTouch with a slide, but no 1ghz
    Moto-I’ll give them The charm, just a remake of the at&t thing
    HTC-so lets move on, what are you planning
    Moto-Droid x, and Droid 2, here is the specs
    HTC- WOW, I got the HTC desire HD, and some windows phone 7
    Moto-Tight.

    I’m sorry, but I’m just SO MAD, i HATE ALL THESE RUMORS, JUST FUCKING CONFIRM IT GOSH, IF IT AIN’T TRUE SAY, IF IT IS THEN SAY IT AND DON’T SHOW OFF ANYTHING. GOSH!
    i NEED A CHILL PILL.

  2. jj says:

    T-Mobile, better fucking delivery

  3. Jordan says:

    I’m hoping with all of me that your right, but there’s some issues with the logic here. The samsung vibrant got a score above 1400, just like the glacier, but its obviously not a dual core cpu. So by no means can we conclude that this will in fact have a dual core, although I hope that it is as I’m on T-Mobile and am holding out on getting the Vibrant for news like this. Thanks for the info.

  4. Charbax says:

    Watch my video interview with Qualcomm about their new Snapdragon processors: http://armdevices.net/2010/06/04/qualcomm-snapdragon-8660-the-third-generation-45nm-dual-core-1-2ghz/

    The current Snapdragon is a 65nm processor. Hummingbird and OMAP3630 are 45nm processors. While Qualcomm’s dual-core is 45nm, they might have a single core 45nm in the works as well to be available sooner than the dual-core processor.

  5. Electrofreak says:

    Qualcomm will be releasing a single-core 1.3 GHz 45 nm SoC dubbed QSD8650A. I personally suspect HTC Glacier will contain this chip.

  6. HTC mobile says:

    This is very intsresting reading indeed, I hope you’re right and I cant wait to see what the end result actually is.

  7. tvennon says:

    Have to agree with Jordan on this. I was an early adopter of the myTouch and I’m about ready to throw it through the wall at this point. Finally found a 2.1 update 1 ROM that will run decently. Had Cyanogen’s FroYo RC1 and RC2 on there and it was ridiculously slow. Was eyeballing the Vibrant just the other day until I saw this article. I hope its true or I have to admit that Big Red might be getting my business soon. There’s just no excuse for T-Mo to be left out in the cold when Verizon is getting monster handsets. My buddy and his Incredible running FroYo benchmarks at nearly 15x what mine does. I almost ran over his Incredible just because…..

  8. A. J. says:

    I think some people who have posted here forgot about the Nexus One which I am happy to say (and own) is on TMO.

    To date, I have not seen another phone that busted the N1 out of the top spot especially with the problems Apple has had..

    Would definitely like to see a dual core job though.

  9. TMOprophet says:

    GLBenchmark has a new unprocessed test for the user mbibkit, The device name is listed as “U”. All the info is identical to the pages from the Glacier, but it doesnt have the finished results yet.

    I think this is likely the same device.

  10. toter says:

    I gotta ask…

    So, the Evo 4G has a score of 512 (1 Ghz Snapdragon).

    My Samsung Vibrant has a score of 1409 (1 Ghz Hummingbird).

    The HTC Glacier has a score of 1432 (1.2 Ghz or 1.5 Ghz dual core Snapdragon).

    Why Samsung Vibrant has such a high score using a single core Hummingbird? The Vibrant’s score is _almost_ the same as the allegedly dual core Snapdragon! How’s that possible?

  11. Electrofreak says:

    Toter, because Quadrant aggregates several scores together into a total.

    This article should answer your questions: http://androidandme.com/2010/07/news/droid-x-vs-galaxy-s-and-more-with-quadrant-professional/

  12. Electrofreak says:

    Oh… we’re still talking about GLBenchmark, aren’t we?
    XD

    If you look at the actual CPU performance values, the differences aren’t as drastic as the CPU skinning values. It almost looks as is the GPU is somehow contributing to the CPU skinning values in GLBenchmark, though I’m not sure how.

  13. Travis says:

    A tmobile rep confirmed to me today that the glacier would arrive at the end of september this year. He wouldn’t tell me any details about the phone itself, just kept telling me the end of september

  14. anon says:

    GLBenchmark CPU skinning is absolutely a GPU test. Only the animation is done withCPU, but the GPU rendering easily hides the CPU load.

    In other words, this test measures a different balance of GPU and CPU loads as the GPU skinning version. GPU skinning puts most of the processing on the shoulders of the GPU, while CPU skinning moves part of that processing (i.e., animation) to CPU.

  15. Electrofreak says:

    anon, while what you say is very likely true, CPU skinning also tends to test memory performance because the CPU still has to handle large textures. CPUs like the first-generation Snapdragons did not handle high-bandwidth tasks well because of severe limitations in the memory bandwidth.

    Hummingbird resolved this by (theoretically) using higher-speed memory. Naturally, this would produce significantly higher CPU skinning scores.

    It stands to reason that next-generation Snapdragons would do the same, particularly if they’re running dual-cores; they should have dual memory controllers as well as the memory bandwidth necessary to support 2 CPUs working at the same time.

    I also retract my theory that the HTC Glacier contains the QSD8650A. I’ll leave it to MrK to show us why…

  16. tmobileb says:

    ive been a t-mobile customer since the beginning of time i think and just talked to my buddy (a manager) at a t-mobile retail store he said the end of september is most likely the release date but until theres an actual press release its all just speculation. different t-mobile reps will tell you different things because none of them know 100%. he also told me blogs have more info on the “glacier” then retail reps, lucky for me my contract is up in october so im gonna make them give me the “glacier” upgrade super cheap or cancel and switch to verizon to get a damn droid 2. i was one of the first people to preorder and receive the g1 in my area and i thought it was a great phone until i cracked three different screens and then the battery crapped out, so i got a samsung behold2 free from tmobile and its a week old and the battery doesnt stay charged in this p.o.s either. now they have the droid 2 on the way for verizon and t-mobile is weak sauce with their garminfone crap and htc windows mobile hd2, why no android o.s.? windows mobile is awful i had a t-mobile dash and wing years back both were def not up to par, the blackberries available at the time were much better. just my thoughts on the subject sorry for the ramble.

  17. Chris says:

    I just looked at the GLBenchmark site and filtered the results by brand. The HTC Glacier is listed and the GLBenchmark Pro 1.1 result is 711 frames.

    http://www.glbenchmark.com/result.jsp?orderby=dvsg_best&brand=HTC&submi=OK&benchmark=glpro11

    8/10/10

  18. brianlmerritt says:

    I’m keeping my Nexus One regardless – Gingerbread ASAP is a must!!

    However, 45nm must have benefits on battery consumption too, so looks like the 1st single or dual core with 8+ MP camera and decent screen is also must have.

    I prefer HTC to Samsung on software side, but if they get their CPU to 45nm that has to be a serious consideration too…

  19. anon says:

    Electrofreak,

    Skinning doesn’t have anything to do with textures. CPU skinning only offloads bunch of vertex transformations to CPU. It will cause an increase in BW, though, but it’s not at all clear cut that BW would be the major limiting factor.

    I’m not at all sure your guess of 8650A is far off. Moving to 45nm has probably allowed to crank up the GPU clock, and having significantly higher shader performance to begin with may just give enough head room to justify the results over EVO 4G.

  20. Electrofreak says:

    anon, good info. I understood the term “skinning” in the context of a GPU to be texturing a 3-dimensional object, and assumed the CPU performs the same process (though, I’ll admit that knowing that the CPU cannot perform any OpenGL processing I did not know how this was to be done).

    If the Palm Pre had its Adreno 200 clocked to nearly 200 MHz, it’s not impossible for a 45 nm Adreno 205 to be clocked to 300 MHz or upwards (especially given the 205 normally has a bump in clock speed over the 200 anyhow). I’m still hesitant to go back to my original theory, but you do make a compelling argument to have it put back on the table.

  21. Anh says:

    whoew…and i was just googling about samsung vibrant..i was about to buy it this week.So lucky got on this site..hehehe…C’m on Tmobile this shit better be real or else i’m canceling all my 3 line and go with verizon..but i hate CDMA Tech can’t use it outside US most other asian country uses GSM.:( let’s go Tmobile give us a Kick Ass phone just like the vibrant…and oh i want the super Armoled screen too..:D

  22. Anh says:

    And by the way the reasons i’m holding out for couple of more month.This phone better be HSPA+ compatible this is the only reason that’s holding me back from getting the Samsung Galaxy Vibrant…man…more waiting time…this suck:(.Sorry everyone i’m just *itching..

  23. Dora Kevin says:

    I have a slight dilemma right here. I want to get myself a new cell and cannot make up my mind on which one to pick. First of all, i thought of the Samsung i900 Omnia, which my buddy has. It appears pretty durable, and all seemed cool, but then i started researching other phones. Now my largest problem is to choose between the Nokia X3 and the Samsung i900 Omnia. All advice is welcome.

  24. RuthLewis says:

    Get you’re googling eyes off of me and pass the sketchup. You should be looking for 38.068717.

  25. Pan Bankowy says:

    Best Android phone!.. ;D

  26. Roy says:

    so.. HTC Glacier is Sidekick Twist? I have keep search everywhere thru Google, etc… no luck :(

    I m member Sidekick since 2001 thru now i m still using Sidekick LX 2009 and love it…

    thanks,
    Roy

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  31. Sadye Malandruccolo says:

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  32. Adaline says:

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  34. Zona Celestin says:

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  39. Ruthanne Pietschman says:

    The screen resolution isn’t best, but enougth for text, maps, email. It have a very-gps, multitouch screen, small square shape when is closed.

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  41. Noel Poro says:

    i just wish it had a bigger screen. battery does not last very long.

  42. Colopy says:

    Pleased about the phone. Good value.

  43. Ging says:

    Very good product, I love this cell phone, the screen looks great, I love the size, the finish is very good, very fast, it brings many programs, excellent.

  44. Abellera says:

    The phone feels great in the hand. The screen is bright and contains great viewing angles and contrast, even in bright daylight.

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